Snowclash lvl 20 blizzard

Everywhere I look it says up to lvl 19 blizzard for

Snowclash. Any sane reason this is 20?

From what I have been able to tell, the level ranges of CtC:s depends on the item level, it's not chosen at random within the range. In the past (before

Terror zones), no monster except

Baal was high enough level to be able to drop a

Snowclash with CtC level 20 Blizzard - so level 19 was more or less the effective

Cap and one with level 20 was an elusive and extremely rare find - but with

Terror Zones it's now a more common find. Supposedly anyway.

The same thing would appear to apply to

The Rising Sun as well, where it sometimes drops with CtC level 20

Meteor while the range is "supposed" to be 13-19.

The Rising Sun's

Meteor proc was discussed here: feedback/the-rising-sun-t1536337.html.

There are more items with CtC level ranges than just these two -

Stormrider,

Hellslayer,

Lightsabre and

Boneslayer Blade.

The Amazon Basin article about CtC explains how the level is determined within the range:
https://www.theamazonbasin.com/wiki/ind ... kill_level

Chance to Cast normally specifies a set skill level (slvl), however on certain items the slvl depends on the generating source: it is calculated from the item level (ilvl) and the required level (rlvl) of the skill. [3] The table below specifies the ilvl required for a particular slvl, depending on the rlvl of the skill.

The table on the linked page claims that there's no ilvl threshold to roll a level 20 CtC of a skill that has a required level of 24 (which would be both Blizzard and

Meteor). But it can still can happen, evidently, so I'm guessing the article is either incorrect or missing something.

Okay, I've cleared this up with Pavke, and here's the thing:

The table in the Amazon Basin article is technically correct. Level 19 is supposed to be the maximum level of the Blizard CtC on

Snowclash. The only way to get a level 20 CtC of req level 24 skills is if the monster that drops it is level 100 or above, and there are no monsters above level 99 that can drop these items. Right? Wrong! There are actually 3 monsters that can exceed level 99 when TZ'd -

Griswold,

Radament and

Nihlathak. Apparently, these 3 superuniques have a hidden +3 level bonus, so when you're playing in a TZ96, uniques & bosses are supposed to be level 99, but these 3 will be level 102.

So, this is a new thing that is a side-effect of high level

Terror zones and the fact that some superuniques have an extra hidden level bonus on top of the TZ level modifier.

It wasn't possible in LoD pre-D2R either - except maybe in some older patch; There are "stories" on some old LoD forums claiming that it might have been possible back then but it could also just be hearsay, it's hard to verify. Perhaps it was possible at some point, just not in the later LoD patches.

finally, I was arguing with someone . They keeps told me this is impossible and I told them I saw someone trade it. (That I only see record without image proof)

ShadowHeart wrote: 6 days ago

Okay, I've cleared this up with Pavke, and here's the thing:

The table in the Amazon Basin article is technically correct. Level 19 is supposed to be the maximum level of the Blizard CtC on

Snowclash. The only way to get a level 20 CtC of req level 24 skills is if the monster that drops it is level 100 or above, and there are no monsters above level 99 that can drop these items. Right? Wrong! There are actually 3 monsters that can exceed level 99 when TZ'd -

Griswold,

Radament and

Nihlathak. Apparently, these 3 superuniques have a hidden +3 level bonus, so when you're playing in a TZ96, uniques & bosses are supposed to be level 99, but these 3 will be level 102.

So, this is a new thing that is a side-effect of high level

Terror zones and the fact that some superuniques have an extra hidden level bonus on top of the TZ level modifier.

It wasn't possible in LoD pre-D2R either - except maybe in some older patch; There are "stories" on some old LoD forums claiming that it might have been possible back then but it could also just be hearsay, it's hard to verify. Perhaps it was possible at some point, just not in the later LoD patches.

Wow amazing, thanks I was really scratching my head trying to find a true answer. Appreciate you going the extra mile

Griswold is a fkn legend

I have one muled from a very long time ago and it's only 4% ED from perfect too.

I've had this for so long that it feels like it was from pre-TZ times, but the screenshot date is December 26, 2022. TZs have been around since patch 2.5 in September 2022. I can hardly believe this feature has been in the game for 3+ years now.

This game still has surprises for us !

I took the opportunity to add some info on the item pages about how the CtC level ranges work for all applicable items (

Snowclash,

The Rising Sun,

Stormrider,

Hellslayer,

Lightsabre and

Boneslayer Blade).

ShadowHeart wrote: 5 days ago

I took the opportunity to add some info on the item pages about how the CtC level ranges work for all applicable items (

Snowclash,

The Rising Sun,

Stormrider,

Hellslayer,

Lightsabre and

Boneslayer Blade).

Using Rising Sun and a random line as an example:
ilvl 88 = slvl 17
Are you saying if the ilvl is 88 the skill level will always be 17? Or it can be as high as 17? If Nilithak drops this in a TZ does it guarantee

Meteor to be Lvl 20?

Edit: Nevermind, I read it more carefully and found my answer. It is NOT random. It is directly correlated with the ilvl!

Knappogue wrote: 5 days ago

Are you saying if the ilvl is 88 the skill level will always be 17? Or can it go up to 17? If Nilithak drops this in a TZ does it guarantee

Meteor to be Lvl 20?

Yes, it means that if ilvl is 88 it will always be 17. There's no randomness to it at all - it's a simple function based on ilvl and rlvl (required level of the skill).

If

Nihlathak (or

Griswold or

Radament) drops it when it's TZ94+ it should be guaranteed 20.

EDIT: answered before you edited

ShadowHeart wrote: 5 days ago

Knappogue wrote: 5 days ago

Are you saying if the ilvl is 88 the skill level will always be 17? Or can it go up to 17? If Nilithak drops this in a TZ does it guarantee

Meteor to be Lvl 20?

Yes, it means that if ilvl is 88 it will always be 17. There's no randomness to it at all - it's a simple function based on ilvl and rlvl (required level of the skill).

If

Nihlathak (or

Griswold or

Radament) drops it when it's TZ94+ it should be guaranteed 20.

EDIT: answered before you edited

I didn't pay attention and hit 'back' on my browser and didn't refresh. I should have, to make sure you hadn't responded! Interesting how certain affixes are rolls yet other's are directly tied to the ilvl. I wonder if that's the case with the CtC on crafted items too?

Knappogue wrote: 5 days ago

Interesting how certain affixes are rolls yet other's are directly tied to the ilvl. I wonder if that's the case with the CtC on crafted items too?

I don't think so. Crafted items are affix based, just like magic and rare items - they're randomly generated by having the game pick affixes from a pool of available affixes, and the way procing affixes are implemented under the hood is that there are actually multiple affixes with identical names but different magnitudes. I.e., "of

Chain Lightning" is not one suffix but three, with different proc chances and skill levels, which are predetermined per suffix.

However, charged item affixes are generated in a similar fashion to how these unique items' CtC levels are determined, by taking the ilvl and rlvl into account (to determine number of charges and skill level of the charges).

ShadowHeart wrote: 6 days ago

Okay, I've cleared this up with Pavke, and here's the thing:

The table in the Amazon Basin article is technically correct. Level 19 is supposed to be the maximum level of the Blizard CtC on

Snowclash. The only way to get a level 20 CtC of req level 24 skills is if the monster that drops it is level 100 or above, and there are no monsters above level 99 that can drop these items. Right? Wrong! There are actually 3 monsters that can exceed level 99 when TZ'd -

Griswold,

Radament and

Nihlathak. Apparently, these 3 superuniques have a hidden +3 level bonus, so when you're playing in a TZ96, uniques & bosses are supposed to be level 99, but these 3 will be level 102.

So, this is a new thing that is a side-effect of high level

Terror zones and the fact that some superuniques have an extra hidden level bonus on top of the TZ level modifier.

It wasn't possible in LoD pre-D2R either - except maybe in some older patch; There are "stories" on some old LoD forums claiming that it might have been possible back then but it could also just be hearsay, it's hard to verify. Perhaps it was possible at some point, just not in the later LoD patches.

this level of detail is why this game is so cool. feels like you just uncovered an easter egg

ShadowHeart wrote: 6 days ago

Okay, I've cleared this up with Pavke, and here's the thing:

The table in the Amazon Basin article is technically correct. Level 19 is supposed to be the maximum level of the Blizard CtC on

Snowclash. The only way to get a level 20 CtC of req level 24 skills is if the monster that drops it is level 100 or above, and there are no monsters above level 99 that can drop these items. Right? Wrong! There are actually 3 monsters that can exceed level 99 when TZ'd -

Griswold,

Radament and

Nihlathak. Apparently, these 3 superuniques have a hidden +3 level bonus, so when you're playing in a TZ96, uniques & bosses are supposed to be level 99, but these 3 will be level 102.

So, this is a new thing that is a side-effect of high level

Terror zones and the fact that some superuniques have an extra hidden level bonus on top of the TZ level modifier.

It wasn't possible in LoD pre-D2R either - except maybe in some older patch; There are "stories" on some old LoD forums claiming that it might have been possible back then but it could also just be hearsay, it's hard to verify. Perhaps it was possible at some point, just not in the later LoD patches.

Griswold,

Radament and

Nihlathak are the only bosses that receive random unique modifiers, and unique monsters (and their minions) have their levels increased by 3. Is this the source of that "hidden level bonus"? Is it defined in the data files, or hardcoded?

Anyway, it's a pity that their level is so low. That hidden, but not disabled of Vita Grand Charm affix with 46-50 life, with level 110, remains unobtainable...

ipatrishkov wrote: 4 days ago

this level of detail is why this game is so cool. feels like you just uncovered an easter egg

Easter eggs are intentionally hidden. This is rather an unintended coincidence, caused by a new mechanic (TZs) applied on top of an old mechanic (CtC slvl).
But discovering something not intended by developers is even more exciting!

Trang Oul wrote: 3 hours ago

Griswold,

Radament and

Nihlathak are the only bosses that receive random unique modifiers, and unique monsters (and their minions) have their levels increased by 3. Is this the source of that "hidden level bonus"?

Yes, that's it - they are bosses that also get random unique modifiers. Unique monsters get +3 levels in TZ, and bosses also get +3 levels in TZ - these bonuses are apparently handled separately, and because these 3 monsters fall in both categories, they effectively get +6 levels in TZ.

(I was going to reply to your post in the other thread before you deleted - I wanted to double check with Pavke that I had the correct understanding of it before I posted)

ShadowHeart wrote: 3 hours ago

Yes, that's it - they are bosses that also get random unique modifiers. Unique monsters get +3 levels in TZ, and bosses also get +3 levels in TZ - these bonuses are apparently handled separately, and because these 3 monsters fall in both categories, they effectively get +6 levels in TZ.

I suppose TZ lvl 99 cap is applied earlier (because otherwise these slvl 20 procs would've been discovered much earlier, from any unique/champion/normal monster at clvl 98/96/95).
So apparently the new highest level drop source (i.e. excluding Über bosses with lvl 110) are these unique bosses with level:
min(99 (max clvl) + 5 (TZ unique bonus)), 99) + 3 (unique bonus) = 102

ShadowHeart wrote: 3 hours ago

(I was going to reply to your post in the other thread before you deleted - I wanted to double check with Pavke that I had the correct understanding of it before I posted)

Yes, I deleted my previous post to keep the discussion here, as a game mechanic, not as a site bug.

Trang Oul wrote: 3 hours ago

Is it defined in the data files, or hardcoded?

I'm still not sure about that. The inherent +2 bonus of all TZs is defined in desecratedzones.json and can be edited for SP, but I'm not sure where either the +3 to unique monsters or +3 to bosses come from (or if they are the same, just applied twice due to meeting two separate criteria).