Fanaticism question

When I put in the

Fanaticism in the calc we all love and cherish, it lowers the break points. BUT, does it also count toward the breakpoint with its ias bonus?
Example- level 12

Fanaticism on an amazon with a mat

Spear(standart attack) shows last bp to be 40 ias. Assume no other ias bonus.
Do I now need 9 more ias to reach said break point(31 ias from level 12 fana) or does the ias bonus translate into lowered break points, and now I have to get 40 more ias?

Thanks.

IAS calculators show how much additional IAS is needed to reach a breakpoint. So the answer is 40.

Since we're here, could someone else clarify the mechanics?

• In OP's example, an Amazon needs 125% IAS to reach 9 fpa with a Matricarchal
  Spear (0).
• Fanaticism at level 12 grants 31% attack speed
• The calculator shows that this drops the IAS needed for 9 fpa to just 40 IAS.
• 31 + 40 ≠ 125

So what's the actual mechanic?

Lanceor wrote: 8 months ago

IAS calculators show how much additional IAS is needed to reach a breakpoint. So the answer is 40.

Since we're here, could someone else clarify the mechanics?

• In OP's example, an Amazon needs 125% IAS to reach 9 fpa with a Matricarchal
  Spear (0).
• Fanaticism at level 12 grants 31% attack speed
• The calculator shows that this drops the IAS needed for 9 fpa to just 40 IAS.
• 31 + 40 ≠ 125

So what's the actual mechanic?

It doesnt show the ias needed. Added 20 ias, it just says I have 20 ias, but the last bp is still 40, not 20(if it would show remaining ias, it would show 20).

Are you using the https://d2.lc/IAS/ calculator? Those two IAS dropdown menus have no effect on the IAS table. It does affect the outputs at the bottom of the screen, but that's not as useful as viewing the whole table.

I prefer this calculator: https://warren1001.github.io/IAS_Calculator/ Not as pretty, but it doesn't reset all your inputs every time you want to generate a table.

Thanks, it's so annoying to put in the data each time!
All in all, I'm still not 100% sure warren thought about this interaction in his basic calc, so not sure 100% my question is answered.
Anyway it's just to know if I need a mara or highlord, so I can test.

I imagine this is the table you're seeing?
Add up all the IAS on your weapon and gear. If it adds up to 18 or higher, you'll get 10 FPA. If it adds up to 40 or higher, you'll get 9 FPA.

Was that the answer you were looking for? Or have I misunderstood you?

Lanceor wrote: 8 months ago

I imagine this is the table you're seeing?

IAS	FPA
0	12
4	11
18	10
40	9

Add up all the IAS on your weapon and gear. If it adds up to 18 or higher, you'll get 10 FPA. If it adds up to 40 or higher, you'll get 9 FPA.

Was that the answer you were looking for? Or have I misunderstood you?

Should I put in the 31% fana to the the wep+gear ias?
Or is the 31% translated to my new shiny breakpoints?

Attack speed is one of the more convoluted and annoying things to calculate in D2.

In simplest, overly generalized terms, attack speed modifiers fall into two categories:
- Direct
- Indirect / diminishing

The direct category generally includes attack speed from skills yielding buffs/debuffs such as

Burst of Speed and

Fanaticism. The attack speed modifiers from these are applied directly to your attack animation length as is which is why their impact is so massive and why they then become part of the "base calculation" and are generally referred to as adjusting your breakpoints, rather than as granting IAS.

The indirect / diminishing category mostly includes your gear-based IAS. This attack speed is not applied directly to your animation length but is first sent through a diminishing returns calculation. The result of that calculation is then applied to your animation length. As a result, the impact of the IAS here is generally far less significant than that of the direct category, especially as you move higher in IAS numbers, due to more and more punishing diminishing returns.

So when you look at the 31% attack speed off your

Fanaticism, that is 31% applied directly to your animation length. That's it. As a result of those 31% becoming part of your new baseline, the "diminishing IAS" you need afterwards drops significantly to - in this case - 40 IAS. That is hence 40 IAS you still need from gear. You are not counting the 31 off

Fanaticism again as part of those 40, you actually need 40 more from your gear.

Exceptions apply and the whole thing does involve more than just those 2 pieces but I dare say this level is sufficient to answer your question.

or.houster wrote: 8 months ago

Should I put in the 31% fana to the the wep+gear ias?
Or is the 31% translated to my new shint breakpoints?

The calculator will have already factored in the attack speed bonus from

Fanaticism as long as you have inputted it: So ignore the 31% from the aura. Add up everything else from your gear though.

I hope I'm making sense and not confusing it further!

Thank you both for all the attention!
Understood now!
Highlord's it is!

Just one for the number-nerds out there, you can effectively calculate the "gear IAS equivalent" of

Fanaticism (at 0) and the like via:
gIAS = ceiling(eIAS / (1 - eIAS / 120))

eIAS being your IAS from say

Fanaticism and the final gIAS being what that would be in IAS from gear at 0 other speed boosts.
In this case, a 31% IAS gain from

Fanaticism is effectively the same as 42 IAS from gear would be, meaning you'd effectively lose ~26% of your IAS to diminishing returns if you were to use gear instead of

Fanaticism.

Or in other terms:
42 IAS from gear with no other speed boosts gives you the same attack speed (12 frames in the case of your mat

Spear) that a 31%

Fanaticism with 0 other IAS would. Random added note, the cut-off is a bit lower, you'd reach those 12 frames at either 30 IAS or 24%

Fanaticism.

At those levels, the difference - while clearly visible - doesn't really sound thaaaat massive. That's because you're low enough for diminishing returns not to really kick in yet. If you want to get to 9 frames however, you're looking at 31%

Fanaticism coupled with 39 IAS (theoretical math there, not sure why the calc has it at 40 but that may be due to extra truncing along the way that isn't considered in the raw formula here). Alternatively, without

Fanaticism, you're looking at 120 IAS. So all of a sudden, your 31%

Fanaticism is no longer the same as 42 IAS but it now makes up for 120 - 39 = 81 IAS, solely because the higher/faster you go, the harder gear IAS is hit by diminishing returns.

To visualize that a bit: You start out leniently enough with 5 IAS being equivalent to 4%

Fanaticism and "end" with rather massive hits where 200 IAS is suddenly merely equivalent to 75% off something like

Fanaticism or BoS.

This is also why things like decrep hurt so much btw as they (negatively) hit the same way BoS/

Fanaticism hit positively, meaning you need a crapton of diminishing-returns IAS to make up for their non-diminishing negative impact.