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both are good, depends upon what your are doing are you doing fire / apoc build and need to hit breakpoint FCR see above comment.
Sorry, I'm lvl 93 running Abyss with Bind Demon and Consume maxed out in hard pointsmojoed1 wrote: 23 hours agoboth are good, depends upon what your are doing are you doing fire / apoc build and need to hit breakpoint FCR see above comment.
are you using Consume on the bound demon or making use of Defiler to get -10 to enemy magic resistance and +20% to magic skill damage, also does it scale higher?
got 30 softpoints in mine but no hardpoints, and I rarley use it on Tainted to get more fire dmg.
I would probably use the one with +1 skill & +20% FCR and the minus to Magic / Fire resistances, if you socket it you could add a rainbow facet to get more 5% more skill dmg and more negative enemy res, or use a Uber Ancients Stone.
Im currently using Shako with Cham socket, untill I can re-roll a Diadem with +2 Warkock skill / +20% FCR, hopefully with 1 or 2 sockets, otherwise I'll Larzuk quest it with 1 and re-roll another for three more Eternity's.....
got 30 softpoints in mine but no hardpoints, and I rarley use it on Tainted to get more fire dmg.
I would probably use the one with +1 skill & +20% FCR and the minus to Magic / Fire resistances, if you socket it you could add a rainbow facet to get more 5% more skill dmg and more negative enemy res, or use a Uber Ancients Stone.
Im currently using Shako with Cham socket, untill I can re-roll a Diadem with +2 Warkock skill / +20% FCR, hopefully with 1 or 2 sockets, otherwise I'll Larzuk quest it with 1 and re-roll another for three more Eternity's.....
I'm using a Defiler and Hephasto. My merc has Insight currently but will soon have Infinity. He's also wearing Fortitude and Anduriel's Visage. I'd also like to socket AV with a FCR jewel of some sortDrunkAkuma wrote: 23 hours agoare you using Consume on the bound demon or making use of Defiler to get -10 to enemy magic resistance and +20% to magic skill damage, also does it scale higher?
got 30 softpoints in mine but no hardpoints, and I rarley use it on Tainted to get more fire dmg.
I would probably use the one with +1 skill & +20% FCR and the minus to Magic / Fire resistances, if you socket it you could add a rainbow facet to get more 5% more skill dmg and more negative enemy res, or use a Uber Ancients Stone.
Im currently using Shako with Cham socket, untill I can re-roll a Diadem with +2 Warkock skill / +20% FCR, hopefully with 1 or 2 sockets, otherwise I'll Larzuk quest it with 1 and re-roll another for three more Eternity's.....
If you need the fcr to reach a breakpoint i think hellwarden is better, dmg wise is better for sure, but if you have enough dmg Shako utility is good for p1 gameplay, for mf, survival
I don't think Infinity will help with magic damage, unless I'm mistaken.
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I can help with DClone/Ubers/Ancients/Socket Rushes, just ask!
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Theres no such thing as enough damage.feitan1206 wrote: 22 hours agoIf you need the fcr to reach a breakpoint i think hellwarden is better, dmg wise is better for sure, but if you have enough dmg Shako utility is good for p1 gameplay, for mf, survival
More damage = clear faster = more items and less danger
Magic (=defiler) Consume caps out fairly quickly so you really shouldn't need more than 1 hard pt in Consume. Even with 0 skills from gear, you still wouldn't need to max it as the bonus caps out well before then.Rhaegar86 wrote: 23 hours agoSorry, I'm lvl 93 running Abyss with Bind Demon and Consume maxed out in hard pointsmojoed1 wrote: 23 hours agoboth are good, depends upon what your are doing are you doing fire / apoc build and need to hit breakpoint FCR see above comment.
As for the original question, hellwarden hands down. Unless you're dead set on more MF.
Socket with a Guardian's Light, if you don't already have one to further bump up your magic/ Abyss dmg.
Since there are no magic rainbow facets, Abyss locks don't really need much in terms of sockets, apart from that one Guardian's Light. The rest is effectively just utility (res jewel while still lacking res from gear and such).
Schnorki wrote: 19 hours agoMagic (=defiler) Consume caps out fairly quickly so you really shouldn't need more than 1 hard pt in Consume. Even with 0 skills from gear, you still wouldn't need to max it as the bonus caps out well before then.Rhaegar86 wrote: 23 hours agoSorry, I'm lvl 93 running Abyss with Bind Demon and Consume maxed out in hard pointsmojoed1 wrote: 23 hours agoboth are good, depends upon what your are doing are you doing fire / apoc build and need to hit breakpoint FCR see above comment.
As for the original question, hellwarden hands down. Unless you're dead set on more MF.
Socket with a Guardian's Light, if you don't already have one to further bump up your magic/ Abyss dmg.
Since there are no magic rainbow facets, Abyss locks don't really need much in terms of sockets, apart from that one Guardian's Light. The rest is effectively just utility (res jewel while still lacking res from gear and such).
Interesting. My strategy for maxing it out was because I wanted the max duration. In best gear, I'm currently at 680 seconds. Is there a chart somewhere that shows what you gain per skill point? I'd like to see where the point of diminishing returns is
Yep now Iām curious though my AbyssLock is wearing a perfect Kiraās with a 10/6 Guardian Light jewel, using Obsession.
Once you reach proper gear, your "duration to rebuff" is limited anyways, simply because CtA can't be pushed as far as other skills. So once shouts run out, just cycle through everything. Might as well get used to that.Rhaegar86 wrote: 16 hours ago[..]
Interesting. My strategy for maxing it out was because I wanted the max duration. In best gear, I'm currently at 680 seconds. Is there a chart somewhere that shows what you gain per skill point? I'd like to see where the point of diminishing returns is
Though even without that, the duration is pretty solid either way.
The actual cut-off for no further gains varies and depends on your consumed demon. For defilers I believe it capped out at lvl 11 (-10/+20). That's typically fairly easy to hit with just soft points for a caster lock. And even if you don't exceed it (which you will in solid gear later on), you still already get a 240 sec duration I believe it was. 4 minutes is a ton in D2 terms. ^^
Yes, further levels do add some life and run speed as well but typically your skill points are more valuable elsewhere.
I'm not sure I understand
You'd be forgiven for not understanding--it is all quite confusing when it comes to calculating your demon's health and damage. Maybe @Schnorki can correct me if I'm wrong. Here is an example.
With gear and skill points, you have level 45 Demonic Mastery and Level 43 Bind Demon. When you start a game or enter into someone's game, your demon will spawn, and it will do 2700 damage (lets ignore the demon's base damage) + 735% = 22,545 damage. You can then strip naked and the demon will still do the same damage, because its damage gets snapshot at the time it spawns. Allegedly.
I still don't know exactly how the damage is calculated. And the numbers seem a bit silly when you start adding auras. For example, add level 13 Fanaticism (254%) + lvl 19 Might (220%) + lvl 20 Concentration (345%) = 819%, and your demon is then hitting for 207K.
Seems like there might be a calculation error there, but it kind of tracks. Let's take a pack of terrorized blunderbores in P8. They should be having at least around 60K health, and their pack leader at least double that. My bound cursed Mauler with Holy Freeze and Act 1 merc with Faith (lvl 13 Fanaticism = 127% party damage) is one shotting the blunderbores and 1-2 shotting the pack leader unless they have Stone Skin, and that is BEFORE he gets an Amplify Damage proc. Note: blunderbores have 75% physical resistance, so their effective health is more like 100-200K.
Anyway, I am still getting prepped to test this out. Working toawrd a full inventory of demon skillers and then swapping out all + skills for non +skill survival gear to see if the bound demon keeps his killing speed. But in theory, you could start a game stacking + demon skill and + Bind Demon to the max and then switch to totally Chaos gear while maintaining your super demon. ĀÆ\_(ć)_/ĀÆ
That's the important bit there.
No idea if anyone's truly properly tested that yet for the stats (as opposed to just the affixes for which we know it doesn't matter). I certainly haven't.
The concept/random assumption is simple enough:
"dmg and health based on skill level are determined anew every time you enter a new game, based on your +skill at the time of entering the game".
Entering a game with more +skill equipped would hence yield a better bound demon for that game.
Whether that is actually true, no idea. It is proven false for the affixes so there is a reasonable assumption to be made that the whole demon is simply snapshot at bind (and not just the affixes), meaning none of it works and it doesn't matter.
The assumption that it would work simply stems from folks going "well, that's how it is for a golem so it must be true for a bound demon as well!". Difference being that a golem is actually a summon and created from scratch as you summon it, meaning it is indeed a true summon and "pre-summon stats" are non-existent, beyond using the same base item for IG. For a bound demon, that doesn't hold up as it requires a snapshot of the entire demon at some point to even work properly. Could be a snapshot of the starting demon + affixes added with the rest re-calculated each game. Could also be a single bind-snapshot with no re-calculation needed. Needless to say the latter would make a lot more sense but we are still talking about Blizz here so that doesn't mean anything. ^^
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