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Can be used to make Runewords:
So I used the Larzuk tool to calculate how many sockets a Voulge would have in nightmare and i only got 3 instead of the 4 that the Larzuk tool suggested. Take care with it. Although the tool is (for the most part) very good indeed. it does tend to make the odd mistake.
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The tool is not bugged. The tool assumes that you know which mob/difficulty the item dropped from.
If you don't know that, then you can't work out how many sockets will be given - tool or not
Theoretically I could 'help' somewhat by not allowing an 'impossible difficulty' to be selected for the given base item, but even that has its pitfalls - what determines whether an item can drop in normal, nightmare, or hell? There is often a significant overlap in the minimum difficulty an item can drop in, and even then its dependent on the mlvl of the monster.
All in all, this is a tool - like any tool - bad input = bad output.
If you don't know that, then you can't work out how many sockets will be given - tool or not
Theoretically I could 'help' somewhat by not allowing an 'impossible difficulty' to be selected for the given base item, but even that has its pitfalls - what determines whether an item can drop in normal, nightmare, or hell? There is often a significant overlap in the minimum difficulty an item can drop in, and even then its dependent on the mlvl of the monster.
All in all, this is a tool - like any tool - bad input = bad output.
Are you sure the Voulge was dropped in your nightmare game? Max sockets on a Voulge should be 4 starting with ilvl 26 and all area levels in nightmare are 36+. So it shouldn't be possible to get a Voulge in nightmare and then getting only 3 sockets from Larzuk.
Are you 100% sure you found the Voulge in Nightmare? For a Voulge to have 4 sockets it needs to have an item level (ilvl) >=26.
A Fallen in nightmare Blood Moor has a monster level (mlvl) of 36. Items dropped from monsters typically have the ilvl = mlvl. So any Voulge dropped in nightmare should have an ilvl greater than 36, meaning it should roll with 4 sockets.
Edit: Atari beat me to it
2nd Edit: The only thing I can think of is you cubed the Voulge from a low-quality Voulge? If so, that will result in the item having an ilvl = 1. So only 3 sockets even if you found it in nightmare.
A Fallen in nightmare Blood Moor has a monster level (mlvl) of 36. Items dropped from monsters typically have the ilvl = mlvl. So any Voulge dropped in nightmare should have an ilvl greater than 36, meaning it should roll with 4 sockets.
Edit: Atari beat me to it
2nd Edit: The only thing I can think of is you cubed the Voulge from a low-quality Voulge? If so, that will result in the item having an ilvl = 1. So only 3 sockets even if you found it in nightmare.
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Might there have been a misunderstanding in terms of what the difficulty selection actually means? The difficulty selection relates to where the item dropped (as Knappogue and Atari mentioned), but maybe the OP thought it relates to in which difficulty you used the quest reward?
Like has been mentioned, it’s impossible for a Voulge that dropped in nightmare to roll 3 sockets from Larzuk - unless it dropped as Low Quality (or Cracked/Damaged/Crude) and was “repaired” to normal quality with the cube recipe (low quality weapon + Eld + chipped gem) - that would reset the item’s ilvl to 1 which would cause max sockets to be 3 in this case.
Like has been mentioned, it’s impossible for a Voulge that dropped in nightmare to roll 3 sockets from Larzuk - unless it dropped as Low Quality (or Cracked/Damaged/Crude) and was “repaired” to normal quality with the cube recipe (low quality weapon + Eld + chipped gem) - that would reset the item’s ilvl to 1 which would cause max sockets to be 3 in this case.
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Sorry guys, been away for a bit.... so i assumed that the tool calculated at whatever the item is socketed at (Normal, NM, Hell) not the level i found it in. so a Voulge found in Normal and socketed in Nightmare should give 4 sockets (or so i thought) and it seems logical as well. Not so much it seems. I socketed a Loricated Mail in Normal Larzuk expecting a 3 socket outcome. Nope 4 sockets. If the item you want socketed doesn't meet the level requirements then it shouldn't be included at all. (cos you're NEVER going to find a Hell quality item in normal difficulty) OR the tool recalculated to the item level regardless of where you found it.... so a Loricated Mail found in Hell will give 4 sockets in normal (not 3 as the tool calculated). it becomes both misleading and confusing. Otherwise ill forgo the tool altogether and take my chances with the cube. At least the cube gives you a gamble, not a certain thing (only to turn out wrong cos the tool is misleading).
The max sockets are determined by the ilvl of the item, and the ilvl is set at the time of drop, it will never change (except via Recipe: Normal Quality Weapon of Same Type).Chalk6ix_NZ wrote: 2 hours agoSorry guys, been away for a bit.... so i assumed that the tool calculated at whatever the item is socketed at (Normal, NM, Hell) not the level i found it in. so a Voulge found in Normal and socketed in Nightmare should give 4 sockets (or so i thought) and it seems logical as well. Not so much it seems.
A Voulge found in normal may get 3 or 4 sockets depending on which monster dropped it. It doesn't matter which difficulty you're using the Larzuk quest reward on.
A Voulge found in nightmare will get 4 sockets from Larzuk.
A Voulge found in hell will get 4 sockets from Larzuk.
When using the tool you need to input the difficulty where you found the item, not the difficulity where you used Larzuk's quest reward.
Do you know which monster dropped it, in which area and on which difficulty it dropped?
You do need to be certain. On normal difficulty, in the same area, there can be mobs with different levels that will affect max sockets. One example is Chaos Sanctuary on normal difficulty - if a Voulge drops from a Doom Knight, it will have max 3 sockets. If it dropped from a Venom Lord or Storm Caster, or Oblivion Knight, it will have max 4 sockets. If it dropped from one of Lord De Seis' minions, it will have max 4 sockets despite them being Doom Knights because minions have a +3 level bonus. That's why you need to pay close attention to which mob dropped an item if you're going to use it from normal difficulty. That's why the calculator forces you to enter all of these details.
I'm in CET (Central European Time)
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
My profile says Softcore, but I play both Softcore and Hardcore.
My Holy Grail Tracker is for Offline Hardcore.
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My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
My profile says Softcore, but I play both Softcore and Hardcore.
My Holy Grail Tracker is for Offline Hardcore.
Holy Grail Death Count: 1
Do I know which monster dropped it (or even when i found it)? Nope not the foggiest. I keep items for MONTHS sometimes as something to be used later. The ONLY item i know for CERTAIN that will give 4 sockets, is the Monarch shield giving 4 sockets in Hell difficulty. the rest is uncertain. (Like finding a Archon Plate i need 3 sockets for the Smoke or Prudence runeword.... i'm probably better off using the cube rather than wasting Larzuk for something that may (or probably wont) work.ShadowHeart wrote: 2 hours agoThe max sockets are determined by the ilvl of the item, and the ilvl is set at the time of drop, it will never change (except via Recipe: Normal Quality Weapon of Same Type).Chalk6ix_NZ wrote: 2 hours agoSorry guys, been away for a bit.... so i assumed that the tool calculated at whatever the item is socketed at (Normal, NM, Hell) not the level i found it in. so a Voulge found in Normal and socketed in Nightmare should give 4 sockets (or so i thought) and it seems logical as well. Not so much it seems.
A Voulge found in normal may get 3 or 4 sockets depending on which monster dropped it. It doesn't matter which difficulty you're using the Larzuk quest reward on.
A Voulge found in nightmare will get 4 sockets from Larzuk.
A Voulge found in hell will get 4 sockets from Larzuk.
When using the tool you need to input the difficulty where you found the item, not the difficulity where you used Larzuk's quest reward.
Do you know which monster dropped it, in which area and on which difficulty it dropped?
You do need to be certain. On normal difficulty, in the same area, there can be mobs with different levels that will affect max sockets. One example is Chaos Sanctuary on normal difficulty - if a Voulge drops from a Doom Knight, it will have max 3 sockets. If it dropped from a Venom Lord or Storm Caster, or Oblivion Knight, it will have max 4 sockets. If it dropped from one of Lord De Seis' minions, it will have max 4 sockets despite them being Doom Knights because minions have a +3 level bonus. That's why you need to pay close attention to which mob dropped an item if you're going to use it from normal difficulty. That's why the calculator forces you to enter all of these details.
I understand that! I'm the same really - the only time I do pay close attention is when I'm looking for something specific, like when I'm starting a new char (such as a ladder reset) and I'm looking to make my first Spirit or Insight. If you pay attention you can find a Spirit/Insight base as early as Act 4 as you progress through the game naturally (actually even sooner but there are very few enemies that are high enough level before Act 4). Often I can entirely skip farming cow level on Normal by just using something I've found along the way, but then one needs to be certain of the drop circumstances, like I said. Cow level on normal is generally the safe option for sword/polearm bases for Spirit/Insight, since their levels pefectly aligns with the max socket ilvl ranges and you don't need to worry about different mob types in the same zone and it also doesn't matter if they're minions or not since the extra +3 level doesn't make a difference in that particular case.Chalk6ix_NZ wrote: 2 hours agoDo I know which monster dropped it (or even when i found it)? Nope not the foggiest. I keep items for MONTHS sometimes as something to be used later. The ONLY item i know for CERTAIN that will give 4 sockets, is the Monarch shield giving 4 sockets in Hell difficulty. the rest is uncertain.
I'm in CET (Central European Time)
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
My profile says Softcore, but I play both Softcore and Hardcore.
My Holy Grail Tracker is for Offline Hardcore.
Holy Grail Death Count: 1
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
My profile says Softcore, but I play both Softcore and Hardcore.
My Holy Grail Tracker is for Offline Hardcore.
Holy Grail Death Count: 1
Certain combinations shouldn't be allowed.... like Archon Plate dropped off a Goatman in Act 1 Normal WILL NEVER HAPPEN. Yet the tool says it'll give 3 sockets. What's the bet it wont?ShadowHeart wrote: 1 hour agoI understand that! I'm the same really - the only time I do pay close attention is when I'm looking for something specific, like when I'm starting a new char (such as a ladder reset) and I'm looking to make my first Spirit or Insight. If you pay attention you can find a Spirit/Insight base as early as Act 4 as you progress through the game naturally (actually even sooner but there are very few enemies that are high enough level before Act 4). Often I can entirely skip farming cow level on Normal by just using something I've found along the way, but then one needs to be certain of the drop circumstances, like I said. Cow level on normal is generally the safe option for sword/polearm bases for Spirit/Insight, since their levels pefectly aligns with the max socket ilvl ranges and you don't need to worry about different mob types in the same zone and it also doesn't matter if they're minions or not since the extra +3 level doesn't make a difference in that particular case.Chalk6ix_NZ wrote: 2 hours agoDo I know which monster dropped it (or even when i found it)? Nope not the foggiest. I keep items for MONTHS sometimes as something to be used later. The ONLY item i know for CERTAIN that will give 4 sockets, is the Monarch shield giving 4 sockets in Hell difficulty. the rest is uncertain.
You're right, some combinations could probably be naturally excluded. All the data is available, it's just a matter of putting it together. Feel free to make a suggestion about it.Chalk6ix_NZ wrote: 1 hour agoCertain combinations shouldn't be allowed.... like Archon Plate dropped off a Goatman in Act 1 Normal WILL NEVER HAPPEN. Yet the tool says it'll give 3 sockets. What's the bet it wont?
(There are other enhancements that can be made, like when you've selected an area, only allow selection of the mob types that can actually appear in that area)
In the particular case you mention, while the Archon Plate technically can't even drop in Normal, it is possible to have an Archon Plate with max 3 sockets - that's if you found one on Hell that is Low Quality (or Cracked/Damaged/Crude), and convert it to normal quality in the cube with a chipped gem and an El rune. Doing that sets the ilvl to 1, and this would result in Larzuk giving it 3 sockets, not 4. If you leave it as Low Quality it will get 4 sockets from Larzuk. But for the purpose of the calculator, it can't drop at that state under those circumstances, you're right.
I'm in CET (Central European Time)
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
My profile says Softcore, but I play both Softcore and Hardcore.
My Holy Grail Tracker is for Offline Hardcore.
Holy Grail Death Count: 1
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
My profile says Softcore, but I play both Softcore and Hardcore.
My Holy Grail Tracker is for Offline Hardcore.
Holy Grail Death Count: 1
Pretty certain it gave 3 sockets....
That's why they asked if you're certain it dropped in NM. If the ilvl is 25 or lower it would indeed get 3 sockets, but that shouldn't be possible for an item dropped in a NM game.
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The tool is not bugged. The tool assumes that you know which mob/difficulty the item dropped from.
If you don't know that, then you can't work out how many sockets will be given - tool or not
Theoretically I could 'help' somewhat by not allowing an 'impossible difficulty' to be selected for the given base item, but even that has its pitfalls - what determines whether an item can drop in normal, nightmare, or hell? There is often a significant overlap in the minimum difficulty an item can drop in, and even then its dependent on the mlvl of the monster.
All in all, this is a tool - like any tool - bad input = bad output.
This post was marked as the best answer.If you don't know that, then you can't work out how many sockets will be given - tool or not
Theoretically I could 'help' somewhat by not allowing an 'impossible difficulty' to be selected for the given base item, but even that has its pitfalls - what determines whether an item can drop in normal, nightmare, or hell? There is often a significant overlap in the minimum difficulty an item can drop in, and even then its dependent on the mlvl of the monster.
All in all, this is a tool - like any tool - bad input = bad output.
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