hallo,
i am old d2r player, i have joined this forum long time ago, what i noticed some time ago that we have gain many toxic people who use new players who doesn't know economics of this game yet.
i would like to let you know there are many ways to check the price of item you are willing to sale, the best thing to do will be checking old prices (have on mind new ladder is very expensive).
i've seen so many lowballers here lately, before you would have seen people who are helping to new playersm who brings something positive here, nowadays you see pathetic players who use you here and sell those items elsewhere. just spend few more minutes of checking how much your item is worth....
so before you put listing on just spend few seconds to check how much is it worth, because at this time trhere is many people here who buy cheap here and sell expensive in otherplaces like REDACTED. gl everybody
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hallo,
i am old d2r player, i have joined this forum long time ago, what i noticed some time ago that we have gain many toxic people who use new players who doesn't know economics of this game yet.
i would like to let you know there are many ways to check the price of item you are willing to sale, the best thing to do will be checking old prices (have on mind new ladder is very expensive).
i've seen so many lowballers here lately, before you would have seen people who are helping to new playersm who brings something positive here, nowadays you see pathetic players who use you here and sell those items elsewhere. just spend few more minutes of checking how much your item is worth....
so before you put listing on just spend few seconds to check how much is it worth, because at this time trhere is many people here who buy cheap here and sell expensive in otherplaces like REDACTED. gl everybody
Description by i am old d2r player, i have joined this forum long time ago, what i noticed some time ago that we have gain many toxic people who use new players who doesn't know economics of this game yet.
i would like to let you know there are many ways to check the price of item you are willing to sale, the best thing to do will be checking old prices (have on mind new ladder is very expensive).
i've seen so many lowballers here lately, before you would have seen people who are helping to new playersm who brings something positive here, nowadays you see pathetic players who use you here and sell those items elsewhere. just spend few more minutes of checking how much your item is worth....
so before you put listing on just spend few seconds to check how much is it worth, because at this time trhere is many people here who buy cheap here and sell expensive in otherplaces like REDACTED. gl everybody
ShadowHeart
Can be used to make Runewords:
While I agree that there is certainly some "lowballing" going on, do keep in mind that some people genuinely have different value-assignments for the same item and hence (legitimately) offer what they believe is fair value. It is then up to the seller to decide whether they, too believe that is fair or sufficient, even if it may be somewhat below some historic pricing.
On the flipside, there's also folks selling stuff (or trying to) at pricing that is far beyond what you would pay for the same thing either historically here or e.g. ingame. The argument often being "fair price according to platform xyz!".
Fact is, common (i.e. "fair") pricing for the same item often times differs quite significantly between the different trading platforms (due to differing customer bases) and even more so compared to ingame pricing. The truth in this case isn't even somewhere in the middle but there genuinely are different truths because the sellers/buyers and hence the economies are not fully overlapping (I dare say they're hardly overlapping at all) between the different channels/platforms. As a result, if you compare everything to other platforms, you will always find (very) different results in either direction but that doesn't inherently mean someone here is intentionally lowballing (or highballing...there are cases where pricing here is higher after all).
Yes, there will be people savvy enough to buy low on the cheap platform for item xyz and then sell high on the more expensive platform but so long as the pricing is roughly in line within each such platform, I for one see nothing wrong with that. Capitalizing on arbitrage isn't a new concept after all. If you as a trader would prefer to benefit off that arbitrage yourself, rather than someone else reselling your item, it would be up to you to explore all of the different platforms to maximize your gains. But if you prefer the convenience of only dealing with one platform (as I for example always have...never bothered actually using the others), you cannot legitimately expect to receive other-platform-pricing on the one you're using and you will have to accept that someone else may try to capitalize on the arbitrage you yourself chose to not pursue.
(The same applies even within the same trading site(s) when comparing e.g. PC to consoles)
All that said, if you spot someone who is consistently trying to "abuse noobs" by offering unacceptably low prices across the board (compared to normal pricing here, not playform xyz/ingame), despite being well established/experienced themselves and hence knowing better, do feel free to point them out to us moderators. But please do not call out folks in a public shaming style post here (hence the user noted in your post having been redacted).
If it is merely someone annoying you because they don't ever meet your personal expectations of pricing (valid or not as they may be), then the squelch feature is your friend.
As for new users:
Using the price check feature (price-check/) is indeed good advice. You can easily look up the trading and price history for the same/similar items in the past. Do make sure to note though that there are often significant differences between ladder and non-ladder as well as within ladder itself, depending on how long the season has already been running. Additionally, you will often see significant differences between SC and HC as well as between PC and individual consoles. So when looking for fair pricing information for your trade(s), do make sure you're looking at the correct game modes and platform.
On the flipside, there's also folks selling stuff (or trying to) at pricing that is far beyond what you would pay for the same thing either historically here or e.g. ingame. The argument often being "fair price according to platform xyz!".
Fact is, common (i.e. "fair") pricing for the same item often times differs quite significantly between the different trading platforms (due to differing customer bases) and even more so compared to ingame pricing. The truth in this case isn't even somewhere in the middle but there genuinely are different truths because the sellers/buyers and hence the economies are not fully overlapping (I dare say they're hardly overlapping at all) between the different channels/platforms. As a result, if you compare everything to other platforms, you will always find (very) different results in either direction but that doesn't inherently mean someone here is intentionally lowballing (or highballing...there are cases where pricing here is higher after all).
Yes, there will be people savvy enough to buy low on the cheap platform for item xyz and then sell high on the more expensive platform but so long as the pricing is roughly in line within each such platform, I for one see nothing wrong with that. Capitalizing on arbitrage isn't a new concept after all. If you as a trader would prefer to benefit off that arbitrage yourself, rather than someone else reselling your item, it would be up to you to explore all of the different platforms to maximize your gains. But if you prefer the convenience of only dealing with one platform (as I for example always have...never bothered actually using the others), you cannot legitimately expect to receive other-platform-pricing on the one you're using and you will have to accept that someone else may try to capitalize on the arbitrage you yourself chose to not pursue.
(The same applies even within the same trading site(s) when comparing e.g. PC to consoles)
All that said, if you spot someone who is consistently trying to "abuse noobs" by offering unacceptably low prices across the board (compared to normal pricing here, not playform xyz/ingame), despite being well established/experienced themselves and hence knowing better, do feel free to point them out to us moderators. But please do not call out folks in a public shaming style post here (hence the user noted in your post having been redacted).
If it is merely someone annoying you because they don't ever meet your personal expectations of pricing (valid or not as they may be), then the squelch feature is your friend.
As for new users:
Using the price check feature (price-check/) is indeed good advice. You can easily look up the trading and price history for the same/similar items in the past. Do make sure to note though that there are often significant differences between ladder and non-ladder as well as within ladder itself, depending on how long the season has already been running. Additionally, you will often see significant differences between SC and HC as well as between PC and individual consoles. So when looking for fair pricing information for your trade(s), do make sure you're looking at the correct game modes and platform.
Saw a Griffon's Eye got traded for 1 Um once, and then seconds later same guy who bought it offered it for 4 Ist and probably sold it in seconds aswell
A fair number of traders seem unaware of current prices, and as a result will price high or low depending on what an item once traded for or their perceived value, and others will price items based on their need and means. Then there are "scalpers" who will buy low from less experienced traders and resell high. This might not feel right to some, especially those who feel they've been taken, but it's all fair trade. The best way to avoid being taken is to find out what an item is worth before trading and then try to trade with those you trust and feel comfortable with. There are some people who will promise an item of value and then try to swap it with an item that looks the same, but of lesser value, then that is cheating. To avoid that it's always a good idea to verify the stats of an item while it's in the trade window before clicking accept.
Please post offer in item trade before adding me on Bnet, I'm in EST time zone (E Coast U.S)
I like getting good value for trades, it's part of the fun. But I don't think I could do that, that doesn't seem like a good time for anyone.DragyDragy wrote: 8 months ago Saw a Griffon's Eye got traded for 1 Um once, and then seconds later same guy who bought it offered it for 4 Ist and probably sold it in seconds aswell
That's sad to see that happening sometimes.
However, do remember a few things:
- this is not an auction site. A trader can accept whatever offer he wants, not necessarily the highest.
- other platforms exist, so do flip trades. That's part of the d2 economy, should we like it or not.
- and the notion of fair price is really wide. An Ist for something worth Pul- Um (or the reverse way) is NOT crazy. A Jah is.
- also don't forget that there are beginners around. I used to be one myself, and I certainly lowballed quite often... not knowing I was doing so (Oh, cool, a 2/20 amulet, I want one, let's offer my highest rune of Vex !).
- if you think something is blatantly wrong (in any direction too low or too high), you can either very very gently try to discuss it if it's a trade of yours, OR contact a moderator.
> Do not try to chime in if the discussion is already heated, or don't try if you're already angry. You have neither the authority nor the tools to moderate, let us do our job.
As a general rule, we feel that the trading experience on D2io is quite good. Not perfect, for sure, but quite good, most things are traded in an acceptable range of value, and there are also some generous donators giving around from time to time, greatly improving the play for many not-that-rich players. There is always room for improvement, for sure, but being over-strict on pricing can be as bad as being too lazy.
Have fun around, everyone !
However, do remember a few things:
- this is not an auction site. A trader can accept whatever offer he wants, not necessarily the highest.
- other platforms exist, so do flip trades. That's part of the d2 economy, should we like it or not.
- and the notion of fair price is really wide. An Ist for something worth Pul- Um (or the reverse way) is NOT crazy. A Jah is.
- also don't forget that there are beginners around. I used to be one myself, and I certainly lowballed quite often... not knowing I was doing so (Oh, cool, a 2/20 amulet, I want one, let's offer my highest rune of Vex !).
- if you think something is blatantly wrong (in any direction too low or too high), you can either very very gently try to discuss it if it's a trade of yours, OR contact a moderator.
> Do not try to chime in if the discussion is already heated, or don't try if you're already angry. You have neither the authority nor the tools to moderate, let us do our job.
As a general rule, we feel that the trading experience on D2io is quite good. Not perfect, for sure, but quite good, most things are traded in an acceptable range of value, and there are also some generous donators giving around from time to time, greatly improving the play for many not-that-rich players. There is always room for improvement, for sure, but being over-strict on pricing can be as bad as being too lazy.
Have fun around, everyone !
Main: Necromancer / Second: Assassin / Third: Amazon / Check my stash, my crafts and my many cheap Annihilus
Just want to say, if everyone is regulated and not able to buy cheap and sell high, it wouldnt be a free trading market anymore.
Best to do research(buyer/seller) on the prices of the said items.
But yes, if certain ppl u see lowballing or ripping another person off, you can always pm that person to inform them of the value? Or if you are being lowballed, u can alway squelch that person?
overall, i think it is normal for ppl to buy low and sell high.
I see it all the times.
I wouldnt lose sleep over things like this
Best to do research(buyer/seller) on the prices of the said items.
But yes, if certain ppl u see lowballing or ripping another person off, you can always pm that person to inform them of the value? Or if you are being lowballed, u can alway squelch that person?
overall, i think it is normal for ppl to buy low and sell high.
I see it all the times.
I wouldnt lose sleep over things like this
Can trade on PC or SWITCH
It is part of the fun, and sometimes people just want a quick trade. I once traded 20 full rejuvs for an Um rune because WSK was about to hit as a TZ and someone needed to stock up fast. But if someone is having fun giving a newb peanuts for a gg item, like an Um for a griffons, then something is wrong. That shouldn't be fun for anyone involved.d2rppa69 wrote: 8 months ago Just want to say, if everyone is regulated and not able to buy cheap and sell high, it wouldnt be a free trading market anymore.
Likewise, the guy who tried to pull the bait and switch trade on me the other day to steal 12 Jah runes should probably re-evaluate what they think is fun. Because if stealing someone's stuff is fun, it's time to do some soul searching.
I have to say, relative to traderie, this site often has much lower prices. Maybe this gives you a sense of "lowballing". For example, It would seem to you(OP) I lowballed you for a perf facet a few weeks ago, but I actually paid that price for another perf facet here.
This is one of the atrraction points for me in this site's trade section (great community regardless of trading).
As of last season there is very slow traffic here too so it kinda makes sense too.
This is one of the atrraction points for me in this site's trade section (great community regardless of trading).
As of last season there is very slow traffic here too so it kinda makes sense too.
Sometimes the factor of ease and time are just as important to people as cost. Sometimes people are generous and will over pay. Sometimes people are poor and are hoping for a hand out or a gift from god.imnotamessiah wrote: 8 months ago hallo,
i am old d2r player, i have joined this forum long time ago, what i noticed some time ago that we have gain many toxic people who use new players who doesn't know economics of this game yet.
i would like to let you know there are many ways to check the price of item you are willing to sale, the best thing to do will be checking old prices (have on mind new ladder is very expensive).
i've seen so many lowballers here lately, before you would have seen people who are helping to new playersm who brings something positive here, nowadays you see pathetic players who use you here and sell those items elsewhere. just spend few more minutes of checking how much your item is worth....
so before you put listing on just spend few seconds to check how much is it worth, because at this time trhere is many people here who buy cheap here and sell expensive in otherplaces like REDACTED. gl everybody
Not really up to you to decide what other people are willing to pay or sell for. It has nothing to do with "toxic" people, that's just how the market works bud. You arent the only buyer or seller here, and you aren't the only one with unique motivations to buy / sell.
Agreed. I've overpaid (hard) plenty of times just to make sure I get something asap. By the same token, I've also been overpaid a handful of times for that same reason. All part of the game.Asapaman wrote: 8 months ago [..]
Sometimes the factor of ease and time are just as important to people as cost.
[..]
Regardless of that and disregarding normal fluctuation and price ranges though, certain items simply should not be sold here. Or bought here. Or sold/bought on <insert any other platform here>. Which those are exactly varies by platform and occasionally by "time in season" as well but a prime example is annis.
If you want any actual solid profit from selling annis...do not sell them here. Or (from what I've seen) on any other platform. Sell them in-game and in-game only. Back when I was still farming annis by the truckload, I typically had a summary trade posted here just for good measure but out of hundreds of annis I sold over time, I would estimate that the ones I sold here probably made up about 3-5% of the total # of annis, simply because it is so crazy easy to sell them in-game for what tended to be 10x as much or more for the same anni.
On the flipside..platforms are a great place to buy annis if you ever need an extra.
(Exception: true top-end rolls are fine to trade out-of-game, if not significantly better for that matter)
I think this is crux of OP's frustration. Not the folks who knowingly overpay to get the item faster. Not the folks who marginally underbid to score a deal. Not the folks who knowingly undersell their item because they just want it gone. Not the folks (like me) who pay fair market value for items on one platform to resell them at FMV on console for a profit. But the people who knowingly and intentionally prey on the new and uninformed.
Mod : No public shaming please.
Sums it all up really. I'm with imnotamessiah.
My guess was that he's referring to user <Moderated, but yeah, you're right>. PM if I'm right ;0
Sums it all up really. I'm with imnotamessiah.
My guess was that he's referring to user <Moderated, but yeah, you're right>. PM if I'm right ;0
Modded : no public shaming please.
Main: Necromancer / Second: Assassin / Third: Amazon / Check my stash, my crafts and my many cheap Annihilus
Not intending on public shaming.
The fact that I guessed correctly only proves imnotamessiah's is correct.
On that particular user, perhaps. What happened then and how he talked to us was what got him a temp ban, not the actual discussion on the user in question.
Main: Necromancer / Second: Assassin / Third: Amazon / Check my stash, my crafts and my many cheap Annihilus
As a relatively new member that has had pretty good interactions with everyone so far, now you’ve all got me curious!
It’s like hearing the office gossip from the senior staff as a new hire…you know not to ask, but dang you’re curious about what in the world someone was doing to earn a temp ban.
It’s like hearing the office gossip from the senior staff as a new hire…you know not to ask, but dang you’re curious about what in the world someone was doing to earn a temp ban.
Redacted after speaking with Necrach. Will leave it up to the mods.Necrarch wrote: 8 months agoOn that particular user, perhaps. What happened then and how he talked to us was what got him a temp ban, not the actual discussion on the user in question.
JC : Public shaming is not allowed. We said it tons of times. Seems he insisted, so he received a 1 week invitation to chill a bit.
Main: Necromancer / Second: Assassin / Third: Amazon / Check my stash, my crafts and my many cheap Annihilus
Just got my haircut, I think it came out nice if you were wondering. Since this thread is very relevant to the few comments you left for me I figured we can continue here. What I think are the facts:M1ck wrote: 8 months ago Oops. Sure love chatting with low ballers.
Message me with price hahahaha hysterical honestly.
- a person made a listing for a perfect Eth titans and asked for 4x Jah. I responded with 'me' as in, I'd like to take it for the offered price and you got upset (I think others did as well in that listing)
- you don't like that I have listings for gg items without posting an offer in them
- you don't seem to like that I have a perfect 20/20 sorc torch listed in another site when I'm looking for another in this site?
First bullet
The first point has been covered here some but maybe you have a different view? Someone made a listing with a buy now price, I went in there, and said yes I'll buy it for the BIN price. I didn't set the price, I simply agreed to the terms made by the person making the list. How do you think I should handle these instead? Should I monitor all listing and pm all sellers that their prices are not good if they are lower or higher than some price you have set somewhere? Should I reach out to each seller and ask if they did their research? Should I consult with moderators before I let a seller know that I want to accept their terms?
You and I have done many trades - we both have over 1k trades done and have all sorts of experiences I'm sure. My experiences have taught me to bid when I see a good listing. I have experienced scenarios where someone posts a listing for something too cheap and I bid (on their price mind you) and been called stupid for thinking someone would sell something that cheap. I've also eperienced the opposite where somethig was too cheap and I didn't want to get insulted so I didn't bid only to find out later it did really sell for that price cause the seller just wanted it gone.
I have a listing for Jah/ Ber where I set prices (I haven't updated them in a long time and prices have changed yes so I need to update but beside the point) and I have had people PM and say something like do you want x for 1 Jah when in my Jah listing I offer a lot more for that same item. What should I say then? Should I say no I will not buy it for 1 Jah and instead offer more?
There is lots of gray area here imo, I don't have a one size fits all solution.
Second bullet
I don't have much to say about this one. Are you saying that all listings should always specify a BIN price? We should not be able to create listings asking for offers? Or is it for certain items and if so, which? Is this a list you would keep track off or saying moderators needs this job? Or is it just me you want to disallow making listings looking for offers?
Third bullet
I trade in three platforms. I also can do PC and PS trades. That's 6 different markets. I spend more time trading, orders of magnitude greater, than playing. I enjoy trading (probably to an unhealthy level) more than the game. Everything I have in my characters is always for sale. You posted a picture in another one of my threads with my traiderie account listing a 20/20 sorc torch for 80 Jah. Yes, I have a perfect sorc torch, I use it, and it's up for trade. Do I think someone will pay 80 Jah for my torch anytime soon, no. I think there's a small chance it will happen but if someone did, I would sell it and buy another. Is this wrong in your opinion? Should I not list anything for trade that I'm using?
I do resale, I don't try to hid it. Heck, I use the exact same username on all the platforms. You can go find my traderie and d2jsp. If I see someone on PS looking to buy a CoA for 10x Jah and I can buy in PC for 5x and then sell for 10x then yes, I'll spend the time looking for these deals and make them happen. Is this wrong in your opinion? Am I not allowed to waste my time trading digital items and should instead focus on playing only?
Conclusion
Anywho, I'm almost done with my first cup of coffee so I'm going to get another. Anyone feel free to comment, I enjoy a good conversation/discussion.
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