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Rolling blue monarch

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Description by BillyMaysed
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Can be used to make Runewords:

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ShadowHeart 2641Moderator

Europe PC
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
ShadowHeart wrote: 2 years ago
Do you have any source for this information and those formulas you presented?
some of the info i personally had to reverse engineer i guess is a good way of saying it but i can provide a few source links for ya to show how i got to where i did

https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads ... ng.628300/

https://www.purediablo.com/diablo-2/dia ... ea-levels/

https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=40498016&f=21

https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads ... d2.445559/

https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads ... on.646687/
Okay, I looked more closely at the formulas you posted, which seem to be copied from a post in your first link, and that doesn't tell me that ilvl is reduced by reach re-roll, that's not how I interpret it.

You stated (same info can be found in the first link);
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
grand Charms,
if ilvl < 92, then alvl = ilvl - .5
if ilvl >= 92, then alvl = ilvl * 2 - 99.
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
large Charms,
if ilvl < 92, then alvl = ilvl - 7
if ilvl >= 92, then alvl = ilvl * 2 - 99
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
small charms :
if ilvl < 92 alvl = ilvl - 14 then
if ilvl >= 92, then alvl = ilvl * 2 - 99
(I added a bit of coloring to ease reading)

This says that the alvl (affix level) is calculated based on the ilvl, and that is what determines what affixes can be rolled on the item. So, an ilvl 81 Large Charm will have alvl (affix level) of 74 and can thus only roll affixes of level 74 or lower (despite the item being ilvl 81).

It doesn't say that ilvl itself is reduced by the roll, it's just a formula that determines the alvl (affix level) from the ilvl.

I looked at the other links and they were not relevant to the reduction of ilvl that you mentioned (they were relevant to other points you wrote about though, sure!) Do you have any other sources that back up the statement that ilvl is actually reduced by re-rolls?

I'm in CET (Central European Time), so that's UTC+1 normally and UTC+2 during DST.
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
7
ok, so u can reroll as much as u want and it will not loose ability to drop same prefix or suffix as at the start. icecoldblood, tnx for confirmation

Image...ladder also
if online, contact me via bn chat for fast trade or negotiations after placing reply here.
If u need help with SCNL "Socket" quest, ubers or waypoints, feel free to contact me. Will gladly help.
7
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
question for icecoldblood.
how many rolls is needed for
Baal's gc to loose posibility to drop 45 health suffix?
With 41-45, it is 25 rolls.
If each life has the same frequency, it will be 25*5 = 125

pm me here (d2.
Io) for trade
7
this topic recalled some memories on good old see no evil, hear no evil scene with detective asking questions in police station... i had to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x84CQaa4Txg

Image...ladder also
if online, contact me via bn chat for fast trade or negotiations after placing reply here.
If u need help with SCNL "Socket" quest, ubers or waypoints, feel free to contact me. Will gladly help.
7
ShadowHeart wrote: 2 years ago
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
ShadowHeart wrote: 2 years ago
Do you have any source for this information and those formulas you presented?
some of the info i personally had to reverse engineer i guess is a good way of saying it but i can provide a few source links for ya to show how i got to where i did

https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads ... ng.628300/

https://www.purediablo.com/diablo-2/dia ... ea-levels/

https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=40498016&f=21

https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads ... d2.445559/

https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads ... on.646687/
Okay, I looked more closely at the formulas you posted, which seem to be copied from a post in your first link, and that doesn't tell me that ilvl is reduced by reach re-roll, that's not how I interpret it.

You stated (same info can be found in the first link);
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
grand Charms,
if ilvl < 92, then alvl = ilvl - .5
if ilvl >= 92, then alvl = ilvl * 2 - 99.
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
large Charms,
if ilvl < 92, then alvl = ilvl - 7
if ilvl >= 92, then alvl = ilvl * 2 - 99
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
small charms :
if ilvl < 92 alvl = ilvl - 14 then
if ilvl >= 92, then alvl = ilvl * 2 - 99
(I added a bit of coloring to ease reading)

This says that the alvl (affix level) is calculated based on the ilvl, and that is what determines what affixes can be rolled on the item. So, an ilvl 81 Large Charm will have alvl (affix level) of 74 and can thus only roll affixes of level 74 or lower (despite the item being ilvl 81).

It doesn't say that ilvl itself is reduced by the roll, it's just a formula that determines the alvl (affix level) from the ilvl.

I looked at the other links and they were not relevant to the reduction of ilvl that you mentioned (they were relevant to other points you wrote about though, sure!) Do you have any other sources that back up the statement that ilvl is actually reduced by re-rolls?
so what your looking at there is this person talking about targeting affix ilvls and accounting for the reduction before he rolls it so he has the proper ilvl to start with with a large charm hes adding 7 ilvls to the item for the affix hes searching for which he will only have 1 shot at rolling for right because when he rolls it it will lose 7 ilvls upon crafting thats what this means ilvl 81+ (74 + 7) i quoted the text your referring to below and like i said i reverse engineered the formulas i personally guarantee they are 100% correct




"For Large Charms, the highest Serpent's prefix has alvl 49 (+ 30-34 to Mana) and the highest Vita suffix has alvl 74 (+ 31-35 to Life); this means such a Serpent's Large Charm of Vita requires alvl 74+. Solving the previous equation(s) for ilvl, this means you require ilvl 81+ (74 + 7) Large Charms, which can only drop in Hell."
7
mockingbirdreal wrote: 2 years ago
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
question for icecoldblood.
how many rolls is needed for
Baal's gc to loose posibility to drop 45 health suffix?
With 41-45, it is 25 rolls.
If each life has the same frequency, it will be 25*5 = 125
this is false a ilvl 99 grand charm will never lose the ability to be rerolled with 41-45 mod as it will always be rerolled as a ilvl 99 every single time
7
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
mockingbirdreal wrote: 2 years ago
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
question for icecoldblood.
how many rolls is needed for
Baal's gc to loose posibility to drop 45 health suffix?
With 41-45, it is 25 rolls.
If each life has the same frequency, it will be 25*5 = 125
this is false a ilvl 99 grand charm will never lose the ability to be rerolled with 41-45 mod as it will always be rerolled as a ilvl 99 every single time
Oh, I was wrongly understood the question.
I was meant the number of reroll get a 45 HP.
And yes, the same charm can always get a 45HP despite how many times it is rerolled.

pm me here (d2.
Io) for trade
7
User avatar

ShadowHeart 2641Moderator

Europe PC
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
[...]

so what your looking at there is this person talking about targeting affix ilvls and accounting for the reduction before he rolls it so he has the proper ilvl to start with with a large charm hes adding 7 ilvls to the item for the affix hes searching for which he will only have 1 shot at rolling for right because when he rolls it it will lose 7 ilvls upon crafting thats what this means ilvl 81+ (74 + 7) i quoted the text your referring to below and like i said i reverse engineered the formulas i personally guarantee they are 100% correct

"For Large Charms, the highest Serpent's prefix has alvl 49 (+ 30-34 to Mana) and the highest Vita suffix has alvl 74 (+ 31-35 to Life); this means such a Serpent's Large Charm of Vita requires alvl 74+. Solving the previous equation(s) for ilvl, this means you require ilvl 81+ (74 + 7) Large Charms, which can only drop in Hell."
Yes, but this does not mean that ilvl itself is reduced by each re-roll, just that you may need an item with a slightly higher ilvl than the level of the affixes you're looking for (and how much higher depends on the item type). The formulas specify how to determine the affix level from the ilvl, it does not mean that ilvl itself is affected by the re-roll. You can keep re-rolling that item indefinitely.

I'm not saying that the formulas are incorrect, I'm saying that the formulas do not mean what you think they mean. The formulas simply specify how the game determines affix level (and thus what affixes can be generated on the item) based on its ilvl, and the affix level is typically the same as or lower than the ilvl. The ilvl itself is unaffected.

Can you list at least one source that says that ilvl of a re-rolled magic (blue) item is affected by the re-roll?
And I've read that thread you linked, it doesn't say anywhere that ilvl is reduced or affected in any way.

I'm in CET (Central European Time), so that's UTC+1 normally and UTC+2 during DST.
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
7
ShadowHeart wrote: 2 years ago
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
[...]

so what your looking at there is this person talking about targeting affix ilvls and accounting for the reduction before he rolls it so he has the proper ilvl to start with with a large charm hes adding 7 ilvls to the item for the affix hes searching for which he will only have 1 shot at rolling for right because when he rolls it it will lose 7 ilvls upon crafting thats what this means ilvl 81+ (74 + 7) i quoted the text your referring to below and like i said i reverse engineered the formulas i personally guarantee they are 100% correct

"For Large Charms, the highest Serpent's prefix has alvl 49 (+ 30-34 to Mana) and the highest Vita suffix has alvl 74 (+ 31-35 to Life); this means such a Serpent's Large Charm of Vita requires alvl 74+. Solving the previous equation(s) for ilvl, this means you require ilvl 81+ (74 + 7) Large Charms, which can only drop in Hell."
Yes, but this does not mean that ilvl itself is reduced by each re-roll, just that you may need an item with a slightly higher ilvl than the level of the affixes you're looking for (and how much higher depends on the item type). The formulas specify how to determine the affix level from the ilvl, it does not mean that ilvl itself is affected by the re-roll. You can keep re-rolling that item indefinitely.

I'm not saying that the formulas are incorrect, I'm saying that the formulas do not mean what you think they mean. The formulas simply specify how the game determines affix level (and thus what affixes can be generated on the item) based on its ilvl, and the affix level is typically the same as or lower than the ilvl. The ilvl itself is unaffected.

Can you list at least one source that says that ilvl of a re-rolled magic (blue) item is affected by the re-roll?
And I've read that thread you linked, it doesn't say anywhere that ilvl is reduced or affected in any way.
i just listed you all the sources you need bro use your brain plug in the formulas with ilvls figure it out its right in front of ya brotha if you really want to test it reroll some 85 ilvl charms and keep track of the reductions then cross reference each roll to the ilvs of affixes and prefixes i gurantee you 100% you wont have a prefix or affix roll thats +4 ilvls above whatever my formula suggests because affixes and prefixes availability is -5 +4 of the item in question's ilvl and this rule applies to all crafting

so yes it does mean that the item is reduced with each reroll in the example above this person is targeting a ilvl 74 affix specifically so they need a item that after it is rolled will be ilvl74 and they know the item level is reduced in the case of large charms by 7 ilvls via rolling so thats why there useing 74+ 7 which is ilvl 81 as the crafting material and the finished product after rolled is ilvl 74 which has the desired affix

i guess you dont understand target rolling or target crafting in general the idea is you want the ilvl to be the highest desired affix lvl as a finished product so that you dont have higher required ilvl mods in your roll pool to give you the best chance to roll your desired prefix

so if your rolling at a higher ilvl you have more crap in your mod pool yes the mod thats available at a lower ilvl is available at higher ilvls but so is a bunch of other crap you dont want thats why you target roll

however it would be useful to go through the charm mods and find different best tier rolls so you know when to stop rolling and call it quits like say with small charms at ilvl 48+ you may encounter a 20 life 17 mana then if you drop it further you may have a chance at getting a 5% fhr +5 all resist at ilvl 37+ ect
7
ShadowHeart wrote: 2 years ago
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
[...]
i edited the origonal post to make the grand charm section easier to understand
7
Lets say you have 300% MF, the highest chance for magic
Monarch to drop is ~0.000024% (from cows) and decreases the lower the MF% is.
Then on each found magic
Monarch you have ~0.00007% to spawn it as a JMOD
Rerolling magic
Monarch's DOESN'T decrease it's iLvl, so basically you have infinite chances to reroll for JMOD and the probability of rolling the correct affixes is just the same as if you have found one ~0.00007%
So mathematically speaking, you have higher chances of rerolling JMOD than founding one. All you need is just 1 magic
Monarch of iLvl 77
Now, is it worthy of doing so ? Depends on if you have anything else to do with your gems or not. ;)

7
Oh, that is 1/1428571.
Rerolling GC is 1/1162 to get +skill and 41+ life.
Rerolling GC is the clear better option.

pm me here (d2.
Io) for trade
7
u need magic
Monarch ilvl 55 for jmod

edit:
if u plan to reroll, it would be nice if u could find area that drops 55 or closest higher ilvl or some vendor gamble lower ilvl monarchs. just to avoid some prefixes and suffixes and get better chance to reroll it

Image...ladder also
if online, contact me via bn chat for fast trade or negotiations after placing reply here.
If u need help with SCNL "Socket" quest, ubers or waypoints, feel free to contact me. Will gladly help.
7
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
u need magic
Monarch ilvl 55 for jmod

edit:
if u plan to reroll, it would be nice if u could find area that drops 55 or closest higher ilvl or some vendor gamble lower ilvl monarchs. just to avoid some prefixes and suffixes and get better chance to reroll it
i dont think jmods able to be shopped or gambled from any vendor but im not 100% sure about that i can look it up tomorrow if no-one chimes in before then
7
User avatar

Bisu 382

PC
icecoldblood wrote: 2 years ago
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
u need magic
Monarch ilvl 55 for jmod

edit:
if u plan to reroll, it would be nice if u could find area that drops 55 or closest higher ilvl or some vendor gamble lower ilvl monarchs. just to avoid some prefixes and suffixes and get better chance to reroll it
i dont think jmods able to be shopped or gambled from any vendor but im not 100% sure about that i can look it up tomorrow if no-one chimes in before then
What he meant was to get a low ilvl (>= 55 but as low as possible)
Monarch for re-rolling.
7
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
u need magic
Monarch ilvl 55 for jmod

edit:
if u plan to reroll, it would be nice if u could find area that drops 55 or closest higher ilvl or some vendor gamble lower ilvl monarchs. just to avoid some prefixes and suffixes and get better chance to reroll it
you are mistaken, perhaps you think that aLvl and iLvl are the same.
aLvl is the affix level - which we need at least 55 so it can have the jeweler's affix.
the alvl is calculated based on the iLvl and qLvl.
in this particular case the formula is:

Code: Select all

aLvl = 2*max{ilvl,qlvl} - 99
The
Monarch's qLvl is 72.

Since we need aLvl of 55 and based on the formula and all known factors, we get:

Code: Select all

55 = 2*max{ilvl,72} - 99
in other words, to simplify the equation and make it more readable and understandable (and to solve it) this is what we get:

Code: Select all

55 = 2*x - 99 (where "x" is the iLvl we are looking for)
99 + 55 = 2*x
154 = 2*x
x = 154/2
x = 77

I couldnt explain it simpler...

7
so basicly u sayin that this all
https://diablo-archive.fandom.com/wiki/ ... Diablo_II)
aint true

Image...ladder also
if online, contact me via bn chat for fast trade or negotiations after placing reply here.
If u need help with SCNL "Socket" quest, ubers or waypoints, feel free to contact me. Will gladly help.
7
User avatar

ShadowHeart 2641Moderator

Europe PC
No, that's not what capakt is saying at all.

Every item has an iLvl that is assigned based on the monster it dropped from (or the area where it dropped, if it's from a container, I think).

For magic and rare items, the game rolls random affixes. The iLvl is not directly used to determine which affixes are available. Rather, the game calculates an affix level (aLvl, not to be confused with area level) from the item's iLvl and qLvl (quality level). The aLvl (affix level) is calculated as described by capakt . This aLvl (affix level) is then used to determine which affixes are available.

tl;dr
It's not the iLvl that determines available affixes, it's the aLvl (affix level) which in turn is determined based on iLvl and qLvl.

I'm in CET (Central European Time), so that's UTC+1 normally and UTC+2 during DST.
My profile says Ladder, but I play both Ladder and Non-Ladder.
7
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
so basicly u sayin that this all
https://diablo-archive.fandom.com/wiki/ ... Diablo_II)
aint true

I just quoted you the actual formula that is used in the game and how this affix level is determined (in this particular example for the magic
Monarch) . And explained it in the simplest way possible.
There is literally no point in arguing with me. It doesn't matter to me if you acknowledge that I'm right, but I don't want other people who are new to the game to come across any of these comments and be misled as you are. All i am trying to do is to help and educate you about the game. ;)

Feel free to ignore anything I've wrote and keep rerolling iLvl 55 monarchs. Doesn't bother me :)

7
capakt wrote: 2 years ago
brgljez wrote: 2 years ago
so basicly u sayin that this all
https://diablo-archive.fandom.com/wiki/ ... Diablo_II)
aint true

I just quoted you the actual formula that is used in the game and how this affix level is determined (in this particular example for the magic
Monarch) . And explained it in the simplest way possible.
There is literally no point in arguing with me. It doesn't matter to me if you acknowledge that I'm right, but I don't want other people who are new to the game to come across any of these comments and be misled as you are. All i am trying to do is to help and educate you about the game. ;)

Feel free to ignore anything I've wrote and keep rerolling iLvl 55 monarchs. Doesn't bother me :)
so its just as u wrote because u r so cool... and i m stubborn mule.
what is ur resource for formulas u wrote? u got page for info, u r coder and reassembled code, blizzard employe?
i didnt offend u in any of my posts or i ve said that i'm right and u r wrong. as i know we ve been tryin to figure out what is the truth about magic item affixes here.
i ve just placed link to page where did i get info and after ur reply asked/made conclusion that info on that page is not correct.

Image...ladder also
if online, contact me via bn chat for fast trade or negotiations after placing reply here.
If u need help with SCNL "Socket" quest, ubers or waypoints, feel free to contact me. Will gladly help.
8

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