are key drops broken?

I guess you jump jump out of 0 Key drop bug glitch.

It is from time to time, there is a zero drop happen sometime.

My personal guess is that server maintain total Key count, if someone use it, it could drop elsewhere. [uber legend]

thebleh wrote: 5 months ago

Are you sure your loot filters aren't hiding them? The chances of not getting any in that many runs are lower than 1%...

I've done over 150+ summoner without any Key drop lol, i know my filter isn't hiding it cause i didn't changed it from last time i seen 1 drop

QCElysiums wrote: 5 months ago

thebleh wrote: 5 months ago

Are you sure your loot filters aren't hiding them? The chances of not getting any in that many runs are lower than 1%...

I've done over 150+ summoner without any Key drop lol, i know my filter isn't hiding it cause i didn't changed it from last time i seen 1 drop

I only have keys from The Summoner… like four of them and I don’t even do Key runs

StoBeast wrote: 5 months ago

QCElysiums wrote: 5 months ago

thebleh wrote: 5 months ago

Are you sure your loot filters aren't hiding them? The chances of not getting any in that many runs are lower than 1%...

I've done over 150+ summoner without any Key drop lol, i know my filter isn't hiding it cause i didn't changed it from last time i seen 1 drop

I only have keys from The Summoner… like four of them and I don’t even do Key runs

I just dropped one, after 150+ runs xD

I got a Key off The Countess just yesterday so who knows!

As a casual player, who only do summoner "run" while it waits the garbage to sell...
I have found a lot of keys and every time it was sold for 8 Perfect Gems in a few minutes. In every 10-12 runs (TBH I clear the whole map in hope I find flawless gems and some runes) I find a key or two. But never seen a double key drop there. Nodrop, or trash drop is common, but my only The Stone of Jordan came from the (non terrorized) Summoner as well.

leox wrote: 5 months ago

I guess you jump jump out of 0 Key drop bug glitch.

It is from time to time, there is a zero drop happen sometime.

My personal guess is that server maintain total Key count, if someone use it, it could drop elsewhere. [uber legend]

Please give a source for this "bug". Otherwise I'll claim that it's just bad luck.

The odds getting no Key from Nihlathak in 90 runs is 0.04%.

That means, this happens to one plaer for every 2.500 doing Key runs.

How many people are playing d2r? How many are running keys? How many will have that experience?

Correct! Many.

It happens. Just continue and the Key will drop. Just as it did for OP.

brentrox wrote: 5 months ago

I am on a generational run of 90+ Nihlathak's runs with no keys. and also done 30+ of countess and summoner with zero. It's broken right??!?!

I feel you, but here's an example of how it works in Diablo.

You go out looking for a specific item explicitly, like a D- Key. You run Nilathak like crazy, find nothing.

Then, some days later, his zone gets terrorized, you just want to farm a little bit, maybe trigger a Herald or whatever.

You dont look out for anything, you run his area, at last, you kill Nilathak.

He drops 3 keys at once, happened to me yesterday.

It is how it is

vued wrote: 5 months ago

Please give a source for this "bug". Otherwise I'll claim that it's just bad luck.

The odds getting no Key from Nihlathak in 90 runs is 0.04%.

That means, this happens to one plaer for every 2.500 doing Key runs.

How many people are playing d2r? How many are running keys? How many will have that experience?

Correct! Many.

It happens. Just continue and the Key will drop. Just as it did for OP.

The bug I feel it happen is based on the code, it is use c++ random seed in server side.

The random seed is not actually random. Hence it is not 0.04% if you know how to produce that issue.

The way I try to avoid it is use different server, its seed will be different based on time, server difference.

In the end, if you know how to create a lot of keys (good luck) and avoid that Key problem, you can further reduce that 0.04% to something like 0.01%.

The way I create Key is usually to see if I can get Key in 6 run, if not, I stop and play it another day or different server.

d2r's random is not uniform, means statistical record cant be trust. if you happen do a lot things in certain random seed. there will be cluster effect.

--
The fact is that we all know there is 'bad luck' bug over there. That we can do is play around it . Even if developer knows it and everyone knows , it doesnt change a thing. As long as there is working part, it wont change.

leox wrote: 5 months ago

vued wrote: 5 months ago

Please give a source for this "bug". Otherwise I'll claim that it's just bad luck.

The odds getting no Key from Nihlathak in 90 runs is 0.04%.

That means, this happens to one plaer for every 2.500 doing Key runs.

How many people are playing d2r? How many are running keys? How many will have that experience?

Correct! Many.

It happens. Just continue and the Key will drop. Just as it did for OP.

The bug I feel it happen is based on the code, it is use c++ random seed in server side.

The random seed is not actually random. Hence it is not 0.04% if you know how to produce that issue.

The way I try to avoid it is use different server, its seed will be different based on time, server difference.

In the end, if you know how to create a lot of keys (good luck) and avoid that Key problem, you can further reduce that 0.04% to something like 0.01%.

The way I create Key is usually to see if I can get Key in 6 run, if not, I stop and play it another day or different server.

d2r's random is not uniform, means statistical record cant be trust. if you happen do a lot things in certain random seed. there will be cluster effect.

--
The fact is that we all know there is 'bad luck' bug over there. That we can do is play around it . Even if developer knows it and everyone knows , it doesnt change a thing. As long as there is working part, it wont change.

Yeah, I know how pseudo random number generators work.
If there really is a bug, this could maybe impact very rare drops but not a 1 in 12 chance Key drop.

Just to clarify: Do you have a source for your claim? Has this been confirmed by Blizzard, by code check, or is it reliably reproducable?

And this server bug, that you claim exists, does it impact the server (i.e. no keys for nobody playing), only single players, or only single characters?

As you're running the expansion, maybe the loot filter is mis-configured to hide the keys?

I'm also farming these keys a lot and I don't believe it to be any different than before RotW. Sometimes not a single drop for 30-50 runs, then suddenly a dual Key drop

vued wrote: 5 months ago

leox wrote: 5 months ago

vued wrote: 5 months ago

Please give a source for this "bug". Otherwise I'll claim that it's just bad luck.

The odds getting no Key from Nihlathak in 90 runs is 0.04%.

That means, this happens to one plaer for every 2.500 doing Key runs.

How many people are playing d2r? How many are running keys? How many will have that experience?

Correct! Many.

It happens. Just continue and the Key will drop. Just as it did for OP.

The bug I feel it happen is based on the code, it is use c++ random seed in server side.

The random seed is not actually random. Hence it is not 0.04% if you know how to produce that issue.

The way I try to avoid it is use different server, its seed will be different based on time, server difference.

In the end, if you know how to create a lot of keys (good luck) and avoid that Key problem, you can further reduce that 0.04% to something like 0.01%.

The way I create Key is usually to see if I can get Key in 6 run, if not, I stop and play it another day or different server.

d2r's random is not uniform, means statistical record cant be trust. if you happen do a lot things in certain random seed. there will be cluster effect.

--
The fact is that we all know there is 'bad luck' bug over there. That we can do is play around it . Even if developer knows it and everyone knows , it doesnt change a thing. As long as there is working part, it wont change.

Yeah, I know how pseudo random number generators work.
If there really is a bug, this could maybe impact very rare drops but not a 1 in 12 chance Key drop.

Just to clarify: Do you have a source for your claim? Has this been confirmed by Blizzard, by code check, or is it reliably reproducable?

And this server bug, that you claim exists, does it impact the server (i.e. no keys for nobody playing), only single players, or only single characters?

let's say if you are QA of blizzard, the only way to issue trouble about random seed problem is based on massive player observation.

And if amount is big enough and if you lucky enough to find the problem. There is no way for developer to fix it.

And it is server issue. Since I am player, what I really care is to avoid this trap and do Key run in normal random seed, not special bad luck one.

Even if there is way to proof it, I am not going to help blizzard's QA job. And I feel blizzard doesnt want people to raise this issue. Not all problem need to be fix if it sometimes works not broken all the time.

bbb0 wrote: 5 months ago

As a casual player, who only do summoner "run" while it waits the garbage to sell...
I have found a lot of keys and every time it was sold for 8 Perfect Gems in a few minutes. In every 10-12 runs (TBH I clear the whole map in hope I find flawless gems and some runes) I find a key or two. But never seen a double key drop there. Nodrop, or trash drop is common, but my only The Stone of Jordan came from the (non terrorized) Summoner as well.

I did now some keyruns to Summoner... The droprate was worse than before my last post. The first Key drop was at 12th run, but after that the second Key needed another 25 runs.

bbb0 wrote: 4 months ago

I did now some keyruns to Summoner... The droprate was worse than before my last post. The first Key drop was at 12th run, but after that the second Key needed another 25 runs.

That's completely normal and expected. The odds of going 25 runs without a Key drop are about the same as getting a Key on any single run for single player Summoner.

I mostly find Key of Hate, then sometimes Key of Terror and rarely Key of Destruction.
And when I get double drops it's Key of Hate

TheSoulReaver wrote: 4 months ago

I mostly find Key of Hate, then sometimes Key of Terror and rarely Key of Destruction.
And when I get double drops it's Key of Hate

I have never seen Key of Hate double drop, only Key of Terror doubles

bbb0 wrote: 4 months ago

TheSoulReaver wrote: 4 months ago

I mostly find Key of Hate, then sometimes Key of Terror and rarely Key of Destruction.
And when I get double drops it's Key of Hate

I have never seen Key of Hate double drop, only Key of Terror doubles

Last night a had a Key of Destruction double drop.