Base for Infinity?

Chaos run finally paid off and dropped a

Ber for me. Now I have 2

Ber for Infinity.

Now I have a problem, which base I should use for the Infinity:
1. I've got a superior

Mancatcher (11 ed, 12 max dura), non-

Eth. I can build a spearazon around it, or run it in merc hands for my lightning sorc.
2. I've got a +3

Matriarchal Spear, too. It is perfect for the spearzon, but my merc cannot use it.
3. I've got a

Eth sup

Colossus Voulge (11ed, 14 max dura). I can

Larzuk it, and create a Infinity for my merc, but I cannot build a spearzon anymore.
4. I can also shop a

Eth

Mancatcher for my merc.

My priority is to build a character who is capable to crash through

Baal. (I haven't got a

Griffon's Eye yet). And also try a 2.4 character like

Nova sorc or spearazon.

Which way I should go?

I have a

Nova sorc and she goes through the throne room and

Baal with ease. Granted, it takes a little more time to kill

Baal, compared to Diablo for example, especially if he gets the Blood Mana curse on you, but that's not really an issue. The Spearzon will surely make much quicker work of bosses, but overall, the

Nova Sorceress is the much more versatile character of the two in my opinion.

Going for Infinity in some sub-optimal base that suits both you and your merc feels pretty meh. But hey, if you really must play that Spearzon at this point in time, by all means, go for it

Thanks for the response, it is really helpful.
One more question on this topic, does the physical damage on merc matter a lot for a

Nova sorc?

Sure, when you're fighting Lightning Immunes. In particular, some Lightning Enchanted uniques will have unbreakable Lightning Immunity, so the merc will have to take those down for you.

DerTwo wrote: 2 years ago

Thanks for the response, it is really helpful.
One more question on this topic, does the physical damage on merc matter a lot for a

Nova sorc?

I'd say not too much on P1-P3, given how very rarely a mob will remain immune to lightning post-

Conviction (you should be avoiding farming such areas anyway), but in your case I don't see this being a thing as if you go down that road, neither your Amazon will have the proper +3 skills weapon, nor your Merc will have a "merc

Eth base". Sounds like a lose - lose to me, unless you absolutely must play a Spearzon

Thanks. I see your point.

Matri

Spear is the clear winner.

Then again, I'm biased af and never understood why light sorces are so hyped..

IMO Amazon using Infinity is for fun when you are rich enough.
Act 2 Infinity Merc is always helpful for all elemental build and more than that.

mockingbirdreal wrote: 2 years ago

IMO Amazon using Infinity is for fun when you are rich enough.
Act 2 Infinity Merc is always helpful for all elemental build and more than that.

^That.

mockingbirdreal wrote: 2 years ago

IMO Amazon using Infinity is for fun when you are rich enough.
Act 2 Infinity Merc is always helpful for all elemental build and more than that.

That is a very good point.

Schnorki wrote: 2 years ago

Matri

Spear is the clear winner.

Then again, I'm biased af and never understood why light sorces are so hyped..

How much better is spearazon compared to javazon?

Depending on how you spec your skill points, a lightning spearazon could theoretically deal more lighting damage from

Charged Strike because you won't need to invest any points into

Lightning Fury. That saves 21 skill points including the one you have to put into

Plague Javelin as a

Lightning Fury prerequisite. A javazon would otherwise be at least a few points short of maxing out all the

Charged Strike synergies even at level 99.

You do lose out on whatever potential bonuses would come from having a shield, which basically boils down to cast rate, resists, hit recovery, and skill points from Spirit or mana recovery from Phoenix. Since Infinity's wielder gets the big bonus to reducing enemy lightning resists, losing out on the facets from a JMoD isn't a very big deal. You could have up to -75% ELR from Infinity and

Griffon's Eye which will melt anything that isn't still immune after

Conviction.

I've considered making an Infinity

Matriarchal Spear, but I decided against it for now because the play style isn't all that different from a javazon using

Charged Strike.

Snakecharmed wrote: 2 years ago

Depending on how you spec your skill points, a lightning spearazon could theoretically deal more lighting damage from

Charged Strike because you won't need to invest any points into

Lightning Fury. That saves 21 skill points including the one you have to put into

Plague Javelin as a

Lightning Fury prerequisite. A javazon would otherwise be at least a few points short of maxing out all the

Charged Strike synergies even at level 99.

You do lose out on whatever potential bonuses would come from having a shield, which basically boils down to cast rate, resists, hit recovery, and skill points from Spirit or mana recovery from Phoenix. Since Infinity's wielder gets the big bonus to reducing enemy lightning resists, losing out on the facets from a JMoD isn't a very big deal. You could have up to -75% ELR from Infinity and

Griffon's Eye which will melt anything that isn't still immune after

Conviction.

I've considered making an Infinity

Matriarchal Spear, but I decided against it for now because the play style isn't all that different from a javazon using

Charged Strike.

Skill points aren't that bad. Fury doesn't have any synergies other than

Charged Strike itself and the same synergies that

Charged Strike has. So just get all 5 and you're done at 92, meaning you have 7 skill points left for the 1pt wonders in the passive tree. Typically, that's more than enough, especially for a javazon who tends to have a lot more +skill adding to them than say a bowzon.
Sure, a

Spear zon can splurge and

Cap valk on top of everything else but honestly, considering java kill speeds in both builds, wtf would you need a valk for?

The real difference is two-fold:
1) You bring your own Infinity: Not only does this grant the zon itself a lot more -res than a throwing javazon would ever normally get but it also means you aren't forced into Enigma solely to position your merc so he gets into aura range. As a result, you can choose to go for a different armor there. Although a lot of folks would still opt for Enigma for the movement speed/

Teleport which then boils down to personal preference.

2) You lose the throwing range on non-bosses. Bosses you'd CS anyways so either one is in melee range there. But for say cow farming, you now actually have to get into melee range. Since they're typically along the way to the next pack anyways, that doesn't actually make toooooo much of a difference time-wise if done right (albeit still noticeable) but it is a completely different playstyle.

All in all, based on both, theorycrafting and what (admittedly not that extensive) testing I've done myself:
A throwing java will be the faster choice for things like cows whereas a

Spear zon is quite possibly (probably) the single fastest boss-killer in the game. Not only because she dishes out noticeably more dmg due to the extra -res but also because Infinity has that neat little side effect of giving her a massive 40% extra crushing that a throwing java typically won't have. Mind you, when comparing top-end boss kill speeds, you're talking about mere seconds difference so make of that what you will.

Personally, I would say it simply boils down to which playstyle you prefer. They're both excellent at what they do but if you don't enjoy doing it...then what's the point?

Thanks for the Insight. I really appreciate it.

Purely for the Act 2 Desert Mercenary, this is indeed an age-old question

Someone spent quite a lot of time crunching the numbers recently in a variety of scenarios, including the addition of being able to use spears for Infinity since the 2.4 patch:
https://www.reddit.com/r/diablo2/commen ... e_eternal/

Definitely an interesting read. Basically the biggest questions are what armor is your merc going to use, can you afford a good IAS jewel(s) for his

Helm (not necessary with

Mancatcher + Treachery for breakpoints), and what is your use case / where do you spend most of your time farming and playing (and with how many players in game)?

The post is focused mainly on Insight + Fortitude vs Treachery, but answers most of the questions and has a lot of informative data to help you reach a decision. The results are surprisingly close between the "top" Polearms. You already have an

Eth sup CV, but if you want things like CB or another effect to proc more often, faster is the way to go (hit recovery is a consideration, too).

Hope that helps. In my opinion it just depends on which character you want to build it around and what your play style is. I'd go with which ever you'd have the most fun playing.

Infinity requires a couple of very rare runes, so I strongly recommend that you only use a base you're 100% happy with. It will probably be a long time until you have enough runes to make another.

Many players will make Infinity into the fastest base possible, because that will get you more value from its crushing blow mod. There is already a lot of enhanced damage on the runeword, so superior vs non-superior won't make much of a difference.

An ethereal base is a necessity if you want to put it on an act 2 merc, because the extra damage will help him stay alive with life leech.

If your merc is going to use it, I would suggest shopping around for an ethereal

Mancatcher. If you plan on using it on an amazon, I would suggest nothing less than your perfect +3

Matriarchal Spear.

A different Sorc question was we already have a topic here: Is there a Sorc built around lightning that she uses Infinity herself? This compromise FCR but uses - light res.

basicnecromancy wrote: 2 years ago

A different Sorc question was we already have a topic here: Is there a Sorc built around lightning that she uses Infinity herself? This compromise FCR but uses - light res.

Yes, there is. There's a

Nova build that has been gaining traction in ladder the past month or two. You wield Infinity yourself (along with Griffon's naturally), max ES (&

Telekinesis obviously), stat dump into Energy instead of Vitality. You can (almost) ignore resistances, and you settle for the 105 FCR breakpoint (don't think it's possible to reach 200). I think most people running this build put Infinity in a normal

Scythe (low requirements), preferably ethereal.

You can make self-wielded work with CL as well, but you would have to skip ES and do the normal Vit dump and have decent resistances.

The idea is take advantage of the inherit -X to enemy lightning resistance of the Infinity. Particularly when it comes to mobs that were lightning immune from the beginning and had their immunity broken by

Conviction, self-wield Infinity should have a higher damage output than if you put the Infinity on a merc due to bringing their lightning resistance down substantially further. I haven't crunched the numbers, but from the people I've heard saying they've tried it is that the difference is noticeable, in particular when it comes to enemies that had their lightning immunity broken.

ShadowHeart wrote: 2 years ago

The idea is take advantage of the inherit -X to enemy lightning resistance of the Infinity

IMO Crescent Moon + Head Hunter with 3 facets do the same job.
You get -(45-55) with Infinity.
Crescent Moon + Head Hunter with 3 facets give -50 and +15

mockingbirdreal wrote: 2 years ago

ShadowHeart wrote: 2 years ago

The idea is take advantage of the inherit -X to enemy lightning resistance of the Infinity

IMO Crescent Moon + Head Hunter with 3 facets do the same job.
You get -(45-55) with Infinity.
Crescent Moon + Head Hunter with 3 facets give -50 and +15

Yeah, sure, that would work just as well, I assume