Need help to make Act 2 Merc survive Travincal council

Hi folks!

(Note: I will type the full names of items etc., since I found it hard at the beginning to understand what's meant by all the abbreviations. Hope this helps newer players.)

My problem is that my Act 2 Merc keeps dying when fighting the

Travincal council (even on players 1) and I can't figure out why. I tested various setups and wanted to share the results (even though I did not get real improvement) and ask for additional input.

Here are the basics:

Game details:
Difficulty - Hell
Type: Solo Self Found, offline

Player number setting:
1

Main char:

Whirlwind Barbarian level 90 with full Immortal King Set
Skill level 9

Shout, Skill level 28

Battle Orders, skill level 9

Battle Command
Switch weapon:

Demon Limb for that level 23

Enchant to add to buffing before going back to the Immortal King set.

Act 2 Merc (might aura, level 90) with available gear:
Weapon:

• Ethereal upgraded
  Hone Sundan, 2
  Shael runes, 1 socket still open (face value weapon dmg: 98-715)

Helms:

• Andariel's Visage
  
  Guillaume's Face
  
  Vampire Gaze

Armor:

• Treachery in ethereal
  Boneweave
  
  The Gladiator's Bane

I basically tried all armor/

Helm combinations, even going all the way by letting

Fade proc from the Treachery and then switching the merc armor to

The Gladiator's Bane. I also eventually added an

Amn rune to the

Hone Sundan for more life steal, all to no (noticeable) effect. The end of the song is always the same: As soon as my barbarian and the merc get busy with the council, the merc fairly quickly dies. And this happens on players 1 (!).

In conclusion, I would like to understand why I cannot get this guy to survive the

Travincal council, although he is level 90 and the equipment is good (while not godly equipment). I managed to make him survive only ONCE during the tests, that was with

Andariel's Visage, the ethereal Treachery

Boneweave, the

Fade proc'ed, and the buffs from the barbarian cries and the

Enchant done. But that might have been just luck.

Note that all of the above is on the setting players 1 (!).

Any ideas?

Thanks!

there is a bug (or design decision) which makes your merc take extra damage from the hydras.

my strat: go straight east past the water and approach from the far (right hand) side and jump into the perimeter of the orb room, then jump into the orb room.
your merc will either go behind the room, or slowly enter the room by which time the hydras will expire

So for merc survival in trav here’s the priority:

1. Fire res (the ideal set-up is

Eth upped

Guardian Angel with Kira’s guardian, both socketed with something else that’ll help, but you can get away with something like Andy’s if you find a way to address the -neg res organic to the

Helm, there’s other options, just so long as the fire res is maxed. Flickering Flame is good too
2. Life leech - the merc needs a way to get his life back, looking for ~10% or more
3. Kill speed - if your spending more than like 2-3 mins at the council it’s too long and your merc just wont make it, no matter the other stats. You gotta get in there and do some massive DPS - the council heal each other so you gotta get the damage in before they do that, either good attack speed or just big hits - most run

Berserk over WW for this reason

I’d recommend swapping out the IK set… it’s good for survivability and general purpose damage, but it just can’t compete with even basic rune words and some other uniques/set choices.

Budget options:
Arreats face - can’t really go wrong there
Duress - cheap (ish) and effective
Gloves - any +20ias should be fine

Boots - gore riders you just can’t beat it (maybe war Travs are good in certain situations)
Belts - lots of options here
Rings - for trav i usually got with ravenfrost and

Dwarf Star - yes

Raven Frost shatters a few corpses, but being frozen sucks worse
Amulet - high lords
Weapon - anything with decent speed and damage, ideally with deadly strike, open wounds or crushing blow would help. Lots of uniques or rune words that can help

Steal Shade

Helm. My Merc hardly ever dies any more.

Main problem is being nuked by all the hydras.

Gearwise you could socket the Andys with a

Ral to counter the fire res malus or consider something like Bulwark in a gg base,

Kira's Guardian (all res) or even Flickering Flame to specifically counter the fire dmg. If available, give him a better res-focussed armor like

Guardian Angel or Fortitude (which also helps with his damage). For weapon consider e.g. Infinity - keeps the CB while making him move faster.

Then try to adjust playstyle to avoid him standing there tanking all hydras. Retreat a bit if needed, just so that he follows out of current

Hydra line of fire, then reengage. Consider

Teleport staff to jump with him either right on top of next target or as emergency

Teleport away if he gets too low.

Hope this helps.

Trav is probably one of the most challenging places for a merc, simply due to the

Hydra <> merc interaction.
That said, none of my mercs have a problem with it under normal circumstances, despite none of them being geared towards it (read: none are geared specifically with

Hydra/fire dmg in mind).

They all follow the same Pattern:
- Fortitude (imo the one and only merc armor for pretty much anything other than a horker [and some gimmick builds I suppose])
- Some leech
- Anti-freeze
- Some sort of BO (typically off my CtA, the Barb's obviously gets a far better BO)
- Whatever

Eth. elite weapon makes sense for the build they're with (Insight, Infinity, Reaper's Toll, whatever it may be)
- They're all A2 (with varying auras)

Realistically, the only way for them to die in Trav is if I do leave them to fully solo it and they end up getting stuck on phys immune affixes (killing both, their leech and DPS). Well, and occasionally if they get hit with

Conviction while surrounded by hydras I guess. If I actually join them and hence more likely than not tank some of the

Hydra hits myself and add to their DPS, they usually don't even drop in health. Merely tanking some hydras and still leaving DPS entirely to them still works just fine as well (minus the prior noted phys immune exception). Essentially, excluding phys immunity, a well geared merc will wreck Trav significantly faster than they can usually get him. This is especially true if he happens to have a reaper's toll in which case even full-solo, his life bar shouldn't even move.

The whole thing does become more challenging when you impose limitations on your merc such as being a horker (preventing reaper's, Fortitude and various other options so as to avoid cold dmg corpse popping). Or, obviously, when your merc just isn't fully geared yet. A low- to mid-level gear merc getting annihilated in Trav, annoying as it may be, is perfectly normal. Trying to buffer that via crazy FR can work but usually makes his DPS even worse so mweh. Just something to suffer through until he gets properly geared. Additionally, it is far more challenging (to put it mildly) on something shitty like an A1 or A3 merc with just abysmal DPS and equally little (or no for A3) leech to keep themselves up.



TL;DR:
Imo Trav is a simple case of 'a solid offense is the best defense'. The faster your merc takes them down, the less he has to deal with hostiles/

Hydra recasts plus the more he leeches at the same time, allowing for easier survival of it all. -> Gear for solid dmg, ignore the instinct of "need massive extra fire res!".



Specifically with regards to the OP's scenario:
Looking at it, your merc (even assuming he is also lvl 90) is certainly short on res by himself, seeing how that should put im at <60 base. While I would personally never follow the approach of "go for 90 to 95 fire res!", you should at least get it to capped though. With that in mind and given the gear you're listing, I would go ahead and make an educated guess that you'd probably get the best results (in terms of him surviving) by going with gaze, pre-procced Treachery and switching your

Hone Sundan to 3x

Amn. You'd lose some IAS = dmg = leech by dropping the Shaels, yes, but a couple extra

Amn will more than outweigh that with regards to the leech and nearly double his regen capabilities. Lower overall dmg is of course not the ideal but if you can get him to the point of staying alive, you should still have enough dmg between the two of you to get it done easily enough. The shaels won't make-or-break that part. Whether that is enough though...who knows. Personally, I'd try to get him a Fortitude asap (which may obv not be that easy for SSF).
Beyond the gearing itself, try to position yourselves/the council in a way where you can soak up some of the

Hydra hits yourself instead of having them all burn down your merc. Additionally, check the SU affixes as you get there and make sure your merc doesn't get stuck on phys immunity.

i have used

Crown of Thieves vs

Travincal for merc for a long time, it felt like he survives easier than with andariels, now i use Cure CoH and

Eth

Thresher Insight, but im also killing trav in seconds now.

Here is my Act 2 merc:

1. Flickering Flame to deal with these bloody Hydras The Council spams everywhere.
2. Breath of the Dying for attack speed, damage and life stolen per hit.
3. Fortitude - again - for damage and resistances.

They will not make your merc immortal but if you are quick enough (read: you quickly kill The Council) he will survive.

Wow. So many answers. Thank you!

On the suggestions that you all made:

Evading - I wasn't aware of the jump-in-from-behind-the-council-chamber trick, sounds like an easy fix when I'm short on gold BUT ideally, I want this Immortal King to have an immortal companion too, and that would of course include standing side by side in combat. I feel he deserves to get gear that allows him to stand by his king without worrying!

Fire resistance / life leech / kill speed: All understood, resistances are at 57 on the naked merc so not great. I realize I am short on life leech, even with my current max of 16% with

Andariel's Visage or

Vampire Gaze plus the

Amn rune inside the ethereal upgraded

Hone Sundan. And kill speed: Yes, it would be cool if they never knew what hit'em.

Swapping out the Immortal King set: Yes, it's absolutely true. I got a lot of other gear that would surpass the Immortal King stats, but this is a romantic thing It's my first character ever made (back in 2000). This is his thing. It took me some effort to even swap the old set items out for new ones for the "green" bonuses, just to keep up with the tougher monsters. Did a respec as well, so that took away some originality as well. However I love him dearly and the set must stay!

I'll test the

Steel Shade. I have one lying around on a mule.

On the gear suggestions:
- (Re-)Socketing stuff I have would work (

Ral into

Andariel's Visage, triple-

Amn the weapon). I also may have some

Larzuk rewards on some lower-level characters still open.
- Infinity / Fortitude / Breath of the Dying no can do,

Lo,

Mal,

Ber,

Zod rune/s missing (RNGesus gave me others but not these).
- I have other options on my mules (

Leviathan,

Shaftstop,

Duriel's Shell on the armor side, plus

Crown of Thieves,

Veil of Steel,

Duskdeep,

Rockstopper on the hat side). However I figured none of them would be better choices than the gear I did the above tests with.

All in all, my IDEAL goal is to put an "immortal merc" next to my Immortal King, as in: Lower killspeed / DPS would be fine as long as survivability is great. Even if players count goes above that measly 1 that I currently have. Not sure if that's doable without godly gear, but here I am trying!

Ever try an act 5 merc?

Cold even give him Bul Kathos swords and really go into the barb aesthetic cancel that they can’t wield both

Act 5 mercs also have great survivability

Quick feedback on the

Steel Shade suggested by Lanceor:

Test 1
- 3 assisted council runs (assisted = Immortal King barbarian fights as well)
- with

Fade proc and then switch to

The Gladiator's Bane
- result: No problem.

Test 2:
- 3 assisted council runs
-

Fade proc only (keep Treachery on)
- result: No problem.

Test 3:
- 3 lazy council runs (Immortal King barb just stands around and tanks, thereby royally chugging colourful drinks but not doing any work)
-

Fade proc only (keep Treachery on)
- result: does not work at all (merc dies quickly)

Test 4:
- 3 lazy council runs
-

Fade proc, then switch to

The Gladiator's Bane
- result: No problem.

I was surprised that 1)

Steel Shade makes such a big difference and that 2) there seems to be a sweet spot between Treachery-only and

Fade proc and then switch to the other armour.

Will try some of the other suggestions too

I'd try using

The Reaper's Toll for merc weapon (non-etheral is fine). The

Decrepify proc is great for your Barbs damage (and merc damage) and it has a massive life-leach which gives you a lot of freedom for the other gear-choices since you're not bound to getting lifeleach from

Helm.

For the rest I'd go with

Kira's Guardian and

Guardian Angel. That way you'll get both the 90 Fire-resist and "cannot be frozen" and you won't even need the

Fade-proc + armorswap.

fraggykrueger wrote: 8 months ago

I was surprised that 1)

Steel Shade makes such a big difference and that 2) there seems to be a sweet spot between Treachery-only and

Fade proc and then switch to the other armour.

My Merc wears

Steel Shade and Treachery. It helps that Treachery is also one of the highest DPS amours for mercs.

Absorb acts like double its value in resistance... on top of the usual

Cap. So 75% resistance and 11% absorb approximates 97% resistance. <-- wrong kind of absorb, wrong calculation... sorry!

Edit:

Steel Shade provides integer absorb, reducing fire damage by a flat amount. Therefore, low damage fire attacks are effectively ignored.

Lanceor wrote: 8 months ago

fraggykrueger wrote: 8 months ago

I was surprised that 1)

Steel Shade makes such a big difference and that 2) there seems to be a sweet spot between Treachery-only and

Fade proc and then switch to the other armour.

My Merc wears

Steel Shade and Treachery. It helps that Treachery is also one of the highest DPS amours for mercs.

Absorb acts like double its value in resistance... on top of the usual

Cap. So 75% resistance and 11% absorb approximates 97% resistance.

I think your numbers are off a bit on that one.

Steel Shade isn't absorb in %. It's a flat amount per hit you're taking.

Guardian Angel + Kira will give you a lot more elemental defense (and the "cannot be frozen").

Also, even when you do get absorb in % (like on

Raven Frost,

Wisp Projector or

Dwarf Star) It is calculated after resistance - so not to the base amount of damage done. Therefore, 75% resist and 11% absorb would only be equal to about 80,5% resist.

If you want to discuss offense vs defense that is off course a whole other discussion.

Goggen wrote: 8 months ago

I think your numbers are off a bit on that one.

Steel Shade isn't absorb in %. It's a flat amount per hit you're taking.

I learned something today. I learned that I'm going senile.

I SWEAR that I saw a % sign for the Fire Absorb on the Steelshade, and it's not there now.

You are of course right on both counts, that Steelshade provides integer absorb, and % absorb is applied to whatever resistance doesn't block, not just simply doubled and added to resists.

I'll edit my post so as not to

Confuse anyone.

Goggen wrote: 8 months ago

Also, even when you do get absorb in % (like on

Raven Frost,

Wisp Projector or

Dwarf Star) It is calculated after resistance - so not to the base amount of damage done. Therefore, 75% resist and 11% absorb would only be equal to about 80,5% resist.

Can we just run the numbers on this, assuming the given 75% resistance and 11% absorb, plus (as alternative version) 75% resistance and 11 -flat- absorption?

--- 75% resistance + 11% absorption: ---
100 damage -> 75% resistance -> 25 damage to player
11% absorption on those 25 damage is 2.75 LIFE being given back to the player
net damage: 25-2.75 = 22.25 (first 25 damage applied, then 2.75 life credited)
("effective resistance" would then be 1-(22.25/100)=77.75%, so this would be the exact value for the 80.5% stated above)

--- 75% resistance + 11 -flat- absorption: ---
100 damage -> 75% resistance -> 25 damage to player
11 flat absorption = 11 LIFE being given back to the player
net damage 25-11 = 14
("effective resistance" can't be calculated since it changes with the initial about of (here 100) damage)

Questions are:
1) Calculation correct?
2) in the first scenario, if you are at exactly 25 life when you get hit, will you die from the 25 damage -before- the 2.75 life credit can be applied? Or will the 22.25 be subtracted "in bulk" when the hit occurs, leaving you with 2.75 life? Bit hypothetical, but it crossed my mind
3) Is the conclusion "% absorption is stronger when % resistance is lower" correct? (edit: had a thought on my merc here before which was erroneous)

Found a good calculation example on Purediablo, here: https://www.purediablo.com/diablo-2/resistance (I hope the link is allowed).

In my initial text, I did not have the formula correct.

According to the Purediablo post, the calculation is (assuming 100 damage, 100 life, and life not at maximum so that healing is possible):
1) Apply resistance to reduce damage: 100 damage, 75% resistance -> 25 damage left.
2) Add absorption amount to gain life: For 11% absorption, 11%*25 = 2.75 life gained; for 11 flat absorption, 11 life gained.
3) Apply absorption to further reduce damage after step 1: For 11% absorption, (100%-11%)*25 damage = 22.25 damage left; for 11 flat absorption, 25-11 = 14 damage left.
4) Subtract final damage from life (previously increased in step 2): 102.75 - 22.25 = 80.5 life left for % absorption; 111 - 14 = 97 life left for flat absorption.

I hope this is now correct

So it looks like -flat- absorption is better when damage amount (post-resistance application) is low (can it heal more than the nominal post-resistance damage amount is?).

It really is unfair to ask questions which delve that deep into the details of the formulas. Inevitably I can’t resist attempting to answer… and then @Schnorki comes in and points out how there is always at least one detail I’ve missed ;-P

That being said… here we go:


Question 1) No. As far as I understand the calculations are not quite correct. Absorption has a “double” effect (applied in two steps). It works by:
#1 first taking away (absorbing) some of the damage
#2 then applying the absorbed amount as a heal.

In your calculations you’re only applying the heal from step #2, but skipping the reduction in step #1.

The actual examples should be:

Case 1: 75% resistance + 11% absorption
-100 damage -> 75 resistance -> 25 damage left.
-11% absorption -> leaves 22,25 damage left to be applied
-2,75 applied as a heal followed by 22,25 applied as damage -> net loss of life of 19,5

This is, as stated, equal to about 80,5 resist. The reason I say “about” is because you don’t always benefit from the heal since the healing is applied first and you can’t be healed above max. If you started at full life you’d get a net loss of life of 22,25 so it’s not always exactly the same as having larger amount of resist, but about equal.

Case 2: 75% resistance + 11 flat absorption
-100 damage -> 75 resistance -> 25 damage left.
-11 absorption -> leaves 14 damage left to be applied
-11 applied as a heal followed by 14 applied as damage -> net loss of life of 3


Question 2) As I understand the heal is applied first (tough I have seen conflicting sources on this).


Question 3) Generally yeah, % absorption gets stronger when % resistance is lower. In the first case the 11% absorb equaled about 5,5% resistance, but if you run a case of 0% resistance and 11% absorption then the 11% would equal about 22% resistance.

You can keep running cases like that, adjusting resistance, and the value of 11% absorption would gradually go from equaling 22% resistance toward equaling 5,5% resistance as actual resistance goes from 0% towards 75%.

Thanks! My editing was too slow, so your fresh answer came in in the meantime. But results are the same, so that's good

Just to add - at high resistances, flat absorption (not %) is extremely good vs DoT (damage-over-time) abilities, as it applies to every damage tick. DoT abilities generally does relatively little damage per tick (but it adds up quickly), like the Balrog's and Flayer Shaman's

Inferno, and with sufficient flat absorption you can basically be healed by DoT (assuming high resistances as a base). I mean, it's true for non-DoT as well but they deal much more damage per hit so it's much harder to stack enough absorb to actually be healed by those.

there are some tips on other thread:
forums/travincal-council-members-tip-fo ... 46512.html