Hardcore ladder buyers and sellers where are you ?

After 10 days there's only 11 items for sale, people just don't play HC ladder anymore ?
And ingame trading is just dull, so where are you HC ladder players ?

Probably off on that classic HC run with Th3ory

Or moved to PoE2..who knows. Ladder has just kept falling off more and more over multiple seasons now, not surprising it becomes more obvious in HC.

They do, They just don't use this site to trade.

I used to play hardcore. Then I took an arrow to the knee. Then I became a parent and I can no longer afford to play hardcore.

I personally do not plan to play anymore d2r ever again most likely after this season.
The quality of this game has gone down a lot. Three years ago stutter / fps lag / crash issue when youtube in the background and still no fix to it. On top of that, the insane amount of bots. Doesnt really encourage to play as everybody else bots their gear. I can play through season without finding a single HR, but there are somehow people who find 100s if not 1000s of HRs in one season. This is what drives me off from the game hard and did so in the original aswell.

Nielzsche wrote: 4 days ago

I used to play hardcore. Then I took an arrow to the knee. Then I became a parent and I can no longer afford to play hardcore.

Made my day

Well, at first i didn't plan to play this new season, but when i saw patch notes i decided to give it a try since Mosaic sin wasn't available for non ladder. Got to say that i forgot how it was to start from scratch, i now have a 89 paladin really ghetto stuffed with quite no MF, but for some reason he is quite enjoyable. I understand that people go trade on D2jsp rather than here, but i simply don't like the idea of forum "gold". After all these years it's amazing how blizzard never thought of implementing an ingame trade center.

Hurricanr wrote: 4 days ago

Well, at first i didn't plan to play this new season, but when i saw patch notes i decided to give it a try since Mosaic sin wasn't available for non ladder. Got to say that i forgot how it was to start from scratch, i now have a 89 paladin really ghetto stuffed with quite no MF, but for some reason he is quite enjoyable. I understand that people go trade on D2jsp rather than here, but i simply don't like the idea of forum "gold". After all these years it's amazing how blizzard never thought of implementing an ingame trade center.

Back in the original diablo days, I used to trade through D2jsp and had managed to collect quite a lot of forum gold and then out of the blue, my account was closed and I lost everything. Tried to contact support / staff many times but I never got an answer WHY my account was closed without a way of getting it back. Just the same repeated automatic message came back.

I dont bot in the game, I dont scam people in trades and Id rather lose in the trade than take advantage of the other, just absolutely no reason what so ever to close the forum account. To this day, no idea why it happened. But never continued attempting to use their forums anymore after that if people can get account closed out of the blue.

Now finally hopped back to d2r and see how it is (which seems to suck hard so this will be the only season I play) and at least found diablo2.io to use.

Semirotta wrote: 4 days ago

Hurricanr wrote: 4 days ago

Well, at first i didn't plan to play this new season, but when i saw patch notes i decided to give it a try since Mosaic sin wasn't available for non ladder. Got to say that i forgot how it was to start from scratch, i now have a 89 paladin really ghetto stuffed with quite no MF, but for some reason he is quite enjoyable. I understand that people go trade on D2jsp rather than here, but i simply don't like the idea of forum "gold". After all these years it's amazing how blizzard never thought of implementing an ingame trade center.

Back in the original diablo days, I used to trade through D2jsp and had managed to collect quite a lot of forum gold and then out of the blue, my account was closed and I lost everything. Tried to contact support / staff many times but I never got an answer WHY my account was closed without a way of getting it back. Just the same repeated automatic message came back.

I dont bot in the game, I dont scam people in trades and Id rather lose in the trade than take advantage of the other, just absolutely no reason what so ever to close the forum account. To this day, no idea why it happened. But never continued attempting to use their forums anymore after that if people can get account closed out of the blue.

Now finally hopped back to d2r and see how it is (which seems to suck hard so this will be the only season I play) and at least found diablo2.io to use.

It seems since the last patch at least the bots have massively decreased. Before it there where 6-8 Clone walks a day in Asia. Now there are maybe 1-3 walks a week in all realms together. I mostly keep playing D2 currently because it is fun to play with my sons and of course because of the kind D2 community here

@oOKIWIOo I dont know how the clone even spawns, but if this is now somewhat empty from bots and its still this infested... Holy sh-t it must have been horrible before.

I stopped playing diablo 4 as the season 6 pay to win season was awful and ruined the game for me. Uninstalled and im never installing it back, waste of 70€.
Unfortunately d2r seems to be also a money waste, wish they would fix the unstability issues. I cant have youtube in the background or constant stutter lag or crash and no reason to it. There is a trick to get it less annoying but it still happens no matter what.

Waiting for PoE2 to become free to play, id be playing it already but cant afford to put money for it especially knowing itll be free to play eventually. The 30€ pack didnt seem like worth the money as all I could get is the EA and some coins to ingame store. Nooo thanks.

Semirotta wrote: 4 days ago

@oOKIWIOo I dont know how the clone even spawns, but if this is now somewhat empty from bots and its still this infested... Holy sh-t it must have been horrible before.

I stopped playing diablo 4 as the season 6 pay to win season was awful and ruined the game for me. Uninstalled and im never installing it back, waste of 70€.
Unfortunately d2r seems to be also a money waste, wish they would fix the unstability issues. I cant have youtube in the background or constant stutter lag or crash and no reason to it. There is a trick to get it less annoying but it still happens no matter what.

Waiting for PoE2 to become free to play, id be playing it already but cant afford to put money for it especially knowing itll be free to play eventually. The 30€ pack didnt seem like worth the money as all I could get is the EA and some coins to ingame store. Nooo thanks.

You have to sell 75-120

Stone of Jordan to summon one Clone. Now think about how many SOJs you have to farm to spawn DClone 6-8 times a day (and this situation lasted for serveral weeks or even months in Asia SCNL). I cannot even imagine how many bots you need to get this amount of SOJs in one day

oOKIWIOo wrote: 4 days ago

[..]
You have to sell 75-120

Stone of Jordan to summon one Clone. Now think about how many SOJs you have to farm to spawn DClone 6-8 times a day (and this situation lasted for serveral weeks or even months in Asia SCNL). I cannot even imagine how many bots you need to get this amount of SOJs in one day

Just for the hell of it:

- 7 spawns a day at 75-120 SoJs each is about 682 SoJ per day to keep that going.
- Assuming for a second Maxroll's drop calc is roughly accurate, you need 5523 hell Andy runs per SoJ or 3,766,686 runs per day to fund the 7 walks.
- An Andy run for a "normal" decent player takes about 15-20 seconds, not counting the

Teleport time to get there. Bots will

Teleport that in a couple of seconds thanks to their implemented maphacking and should be far lower than 15-20 base because most of that is non-optimized loading time (hence "normal", as opposed to "did that fast load haxxing yo!"). So 15 seconds per run max is likely about right. Quite possibly less but let's leave it at 15.
- Considering the 3,766,686 runs needed, that's 56,500,290 seconds = 941,672 minutes = 15,695 hours of farming to fund the SoJs for 7 walks.
- At 24 hours a day, that means you need 654 bots farming hell Andy on a loop to fund your 7 walks a day.
- If you wanted to focus on SoJs/walks, you'd drop to NM for higher odds which would reduce the bots needed to about 389.

We know for a fact (because they broke their game-password-setting at some point a while back and left everything open for us to see) that there are not hundreds but thousands of farm-bots running in this game. Quite possibly tens of thousands+ as that password-break seemed to only apply to a subset.

Even if you assume that many of those will not be running Andy and even if you take out time lost to muling (which you wouldn't actually need if the bots don't suck and coordinate correctly), you still end up with an insane surplus in SoJs. More than enough to be overstocked for your streamer clients who keep buying them while still vendoring your spares for 7 or however many random walks a day to keep your annis stocked as well.

Honestly, if anything, 7 a day is surprisingly low.

Nice calculations. Thx!

But I still wonder how this could be profitable. You not only have to buy the licences but also the infra structure and you have to maintain it, too. Considering the "price" of an SOJ and other D2 items I can hardly believe this is a sustainable business model...

Schnorki wrote: 4 days ago

Honestly, if anything, 7 a day is surprisingly low.

I then suspec that the SOJs to spawn the Clones are the leftovers which they cannot "sell" for real money

But it is interesting that the walks nearly completely stopped with the ladder reset. So either there was a massive ban or it is simply no longer worth it (and/or they did not update their games with the latest patch yet).

oOKIWIOo wrote: 4 days ago

But I still wonder how this could be profitable. You not only have to buy the licences but also the infra structure and you have to maintain it, too. Considering the "price" of an SOJ and other D2 items I can hardly believe this is a sustainable business model...

They sell SOJ (and other items) for real money too. There are many sites for that purpose.
Early ladder, SOJ is at $10 where in many countries people make less than $1/hour.

Schnorki wrote: 4 days ago

We know for a fact (because they broke their game-password-setting at some point a while back and left everything open for us to see) that there are not hundreds but thousands of farm-bots running in this game. Quite possibly tens of thousands+ as that password-break seemed to only apply to a subset.

If anyone wonders whether this is possible, see here.

mockingbirdreal wrote: 4 days ago

oOKIWIOo wrote: 4 days ago

But I still wonder how this could be profitable. You not only have to buy the licences but also the infra structure and you have to maintain it, too. Considering the "price" of an SOJ and other D2 items I can hardly believe this is a sustainable business model...

They sell SOJ (and other items) for real money too. There are many sites for that purpose.
Early ladder, SOJ is at $10 where in many countries people make less than $1/hour.

I know that they sell it for real money, too (I looked up my +44 life pala combat skiller in some item shops just for the lulz ) but I am still baffeld that this seems to be profitable. Maybe on ladder reset they switched most of the bots from non-ladder to ladder because on ladder start you can sell items with more profit..?

Trang Oul wrote: 4 days ago

[..]
If anyone wonders whether this is possible, see here.

Thanks. I knew I posted it back when it happened, was too lazy to go dig it up again though.

oOKIWIOo wrote: 4 days ago

[..]
I know that they sell it for real money, too (I looked up my +44 life pala combat skiller in some item shops just for the lulz ) but I am still baffeld that this seems to be profitable. Maybe on ladder reset they switched most of the bots from non-ladder to ladder because on ladder start you can sell items with more profit..?

If you farm suitable targets 24/7, you end up finding a LOT of stuff. And while a lot of that isn't worth much 1 piece at a time anymore, the sum of it all still adds up to quite a bit.
And relatively speaking, D2 really doesn't need much infrastructure. You can easily multibox more than just a handful of bots on a single mediocre PC.

There's a number of streamers who seem to funnel (nearly) their entire streaming income into runes and such to raffle off, meaning the bot farm they buy it off of gets multiple full streamer incomes at fairly little hardware cost and close to 0 human cost.
In many a country, that translates into a pretty substantial amount of money. Even if you were to base it only on current NL (though they do farm both).


Edit:
That said, I'm genuinely just now noticing this was actually not its own topic (I need to stop posting pre-morning-coffee ^^) so..let's stop derailing the HC trading thread.
Sorry about that!

oOKIWIOo wrote: 4 days ago

Semirotta wrote: 4 days ago

@oOKIWIOo I dont know how the clone even spawns, but if this is now somewhat empty from bots and its still this infested... Holy sh-t it must have been horrible before.

I stopped playing diablo 4 as the season 6 pay to win season was awful and ruined the game for me. Uninstalled and im never installing it back, waste of 70€.
Unfortunately d2r seems to be also a money waste, wish they would fix the unstability issues. I cant have youtube in the background or constant stutter lag or crash and no reason to it. There is a trick to get it less annoying but it still happens no matter what.

Waiting for PoE2 to become free to play, id be playing it already but cant afford to put money for it especially knowing itll be free to play eventually. The 30€ pack didnt seem like worth the money as all I could get is the EA and some coins to ingame store. Nooo thanks.

You have to sell 75-120

Stone of Jordan to summon one Clone. Now think about how many SOJs you have to farm to spawn DClone 6-8 times a day (and this situation lasted for serveral weeks or even months in Asia SCNL). I cannot even imagine how many bots you need to get this amount of SOJs in one day

HOW does one get 75-120 Stone of jordans? In my gaming life with diablo 2, ive never dropped one. I dont know how much mf it requires as I rarely run mf builds anymore since my luck is absolutely shit. I cant even find runes. I dont know what Blizzard has done to my account but there is something weird going on. There is absolutely no way you can play through whole seasons without any hrs, especially when you play as much as I do (I have no life, I sit playing from morning to evening most days)

EDIT:
Just noticed the comments about the SOJ stuff. Jesus christ. This is why I dont play diablo anymore, all diablo games are so infested with bots. No point playing online, but my problem is; I cant get torches, annis etc. myself as ive never even tried to get them since they require certain types of builds. I dont play this way. So I have to be online in order to trade these things but I hate that they often times are botted.

Semirotta wrote: 3 days ago

my problem is; I cant get torches, annis etc. myself as ive never even tried to get them since they require certain types of builds. I dont play this way. So I have to be online in order to trade these things but I hate that they often times are botted.

Since Patch 2.5 you can obtain Sunder charms, so endgame unique charms do not require a smiter build anymore. Sure, there are still better and worse builds, but much more of them are viable than in LoD.

Trang Oul wrote: 3 days ago

Semirotta wrote: 3 days ago

my problem is; I cant get torches, annis etc. myself as ive never even tried to get them since they require certain types of builds. I dont play this way. So I have to be online in order to trade these things but I hate that they often times are botted.

Since Patch 2.5 you can obtain Sunder charms, so endgame unique charms do not require a smiter build anymore. Sure, there are still better and worse builds, but much more of them are viable than in LoD.

I knew about the sunder charms, these are f-cking awesome (pardon my french). I used to hate playing assassin because of all the lightning immunes, but now I can enjoy her fully. My favorite class after all.

Doubt I could solo a clone though with it.