- resistance vs + damage on sunder

I am building my

Apocalypse +

Flame Wave +

Ring of Fire Warlock build in SCNL. Im wondering what is the better selection between this 2 sunders? My current - enemy fire res is -32 , Fire Skill dmg is +26 BEFORE any sunder.

My gear:
Mang Song (with fire facet)
Flickering Flame
Enigma

Ars Al'Diabolos (with

Um)

Magefist

Arachnid Mesh

Wraithstep
Mara
SOJ x 2
Swap: CTA + Spirit
Anni
Warlock Torch

if you add Infinity and play cow level only, (cow have low fire res).
You can choose +Skill damage.

In other cases, -fire res just win all . D2R , this game, almost all - 1 res beat every +5 skill damage.

Only exception is those high hp , low resistance White monsters, only cow and regular cow, not elite, not super unique, not boss, not cow king.


--Infinity is not convenient in cow level.
These days, I also remove it and run pure - res , long range kill quick before Infinity waiting time. This even makes -res more valuable.

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 21 hours ago

...
I am building my

Apocalypse +

Flame Wave +

Ring of Fire Warlock build in SCNL. Im wondering what is the better selection between this 2 sunders? My current - enemy fire res is -32 , Fire Skill dmg is +26 BEFORE any sunder.
...

You have a very strange Eldritch and Demon tree.
And I thought hex spells only applied to physical attacks, not caster spells. Maybe I am wrong about that, because I never used it before.

leox wrote: 21 hours ago

if you add Infinity and play cow level only, (cow have low fire res).
You can choose +Skill damage.

In other cases, -fire res just win all . D2R , this game, almost all - 1 res beat every +5 skill damage.

Only exception is those high hp , low resistance White monsters, only cow and regular cow, not elite, not super unique, not boss, not cow king.


--Infinity is not convenient in cow level.
These days, I also remove it and run pure - res , long range kill quick before Infinity waiting time. This even makes -res more valuable.

Oh I see, i thought the difference so big it should be the + dmg has more output.. then i keep the - res , hehe

Flyhorse wrote: 20 hours ago

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 21 hours ago

...
I am building my

Apocalypse +

Flame Wave +

Ring of Fire Warlock build in SCNL. Im wondering what is the better selection between this 2 sunders? My current - enemy fire res is -32 , Fire Skill dmg is +26 BEFORE any sunder.
...

You have a very strange Eldritch and Demon tree.
And I thought hex spells only applied to physical attacks, not caster spells. Maybe I am wrong about that, because I never used it before.

I mainly used the hex: siphon for mana, so im not sure it is only used for melee, i thought it is also applicable for caster also?

what is the issue of my Demon tree?.. Im use 1

Tainted (

Consume), 1 defiler, 1 terrorised Urdar (fanatism + Cursed) to tank in boss/

Herald fight..

vs. Sundered enemies the difference is
- for first charm: 54.1% damage efficiency
- for second charm: 51.8% damage efficiency

That's a relative damage increase by 4.4%

Since sundered enemies are usually the ones that slow you down and everything else dies in one or two shots anyways, I'd also go with -6 enemy res one.

vued wrote: 19 hours ago

vs. Sundered enemies the difference is
- for first charm: 51.8% damage efficiency
- for second charm: 54.1% damage efficiency

That's a relative damage increase by 4.4%

Since sundered enemies are usually the ones that slow you down and everything else dies in one or two shots anyways, I'd also go with -6 enemy res one.

51.8% or 54.1% is for the - res charm?

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 20 hours ago

Flyhorse wrote: 20 hours ago

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 21 hours ago

...
I am building my

Apocalypse +

Flame Wave +

Ring of Fire Warlock build in SCNL. Im wondering what is the better selection between this 2 sunders? My current - enemy fire res is -32 , Fire Skill dmg is +26 BEFORE any sunder.
...

You have a very strange Eldritch and Demon tree.
And I thought hex spells only applied to physical attacks, not caster spells. Maybe I am wrong about that, because I never used it before.

I mainly used the hex: siphon for mana, so im not sure it is only used for melee, i thought it is also applicable for caster also?

what is the issue of my Demon tree?.. Im use 1

Tainted (

Consume), 1 defiler, 1 terrorised Urdar (fanatism + Cursed) to tank in boss/

Herald fight..

For the hex spell, I really don't know how to apply, perhaps someone with the knowledge will soon answer you.
For the demon tree, however, I wonder if those skills which have more points than 18 are hard points.

Demonic Mastery needs 10 hard points to have 3 demons for sure.

Bind Demon better has 1, 5, 10, 15 or 20. What's the purpose of having more hard points on

Blood Boil,

Summon Tainted, and

Summon Defiler to your build?

Flyhorse wrote: 19 hours ago

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 20 hours ago

Flyhorse wrote: 20 hours ago

You have a very strange Eldritch and Demon tree.
And I thought hex spells only applied to physical attacks, not caster spells. Maybe I am wrong about that, because I never used it before.

I mainly used the hex: siphon for mana, so im not sure it is only used for melee, i thought it is also applicable for caster also?

what is the issue of my Demon tree?.. Im use 1

Tainted (

Consume), 1 defiler, 1 terrorised Urdar (fanatism + Cursed) to tank in boss/

Herald fight..

For the hex spell, I really don't know how to apply, perhaps someone with the knowledge will soon answer you.
For the demon tree, however, I wonder if those skills which have more points than 18 are hard points.

Demonic Mastery needs 10 hard points to have 3 demons for sure.

Bind Demon better has 1, 5, 10, 15 or 20. What's the purpose of having more hard points on

Blood Boil,

Summon Tainted, and

Summon Defiler to your build?

Demon mastery i have 10 hard point, other is from gears..I only have 1 hard point in

Blood Boil,

Blood Oath, Summon Goat,

Summon Tainted, dont know where all the other point come from.. i have 18 hard point in

Summon Defiler to reach the 57% dmg shared betw bound targets... I have only 3 hard point in the

Bind Demon to reach 20+ soft point to have aura when i bind a terroried demon (still wondering the benefit to make it 5 hard point is worthy or not).

is this correct? sorry for long questions, 1st time playing fire warlock, so much confusion

I just remembered that the Flickering Flame and

Magefist also add skill level to

Blood Boil and

Summon Tainted because they are partial fire skills.
I am playing the

Apocalypse build as well with fire sunders. My merc is using Insight, so I don't have to worry about my mana.
I know it's weaker without Infinity against fire immunity, which is why I put 20 hard points in

Bind Demon. At level 38

Bind Demon, the flat damage is around +2400, plus +500% damage. That is like 6 Grief total in damage and maybe more. I bound a cursed, stone skin and holy freez -

Hephasto the Armorer; he hits like a truck.
I thought about putting more hard points in

Summon Defiler. But I noticed that the

Apocalypse covered quite a big area that contained the defiler's targets for most of the time. I feel it's kind of a waste, which is another reason I chose

Bind Demon.

Flyhorse wrote: 18 hours ago

I just remembered that the Flickering Flame and

Magefist also add skill level to

Blood Boil and

Summon Tainted because they are partial fire skills.
I am playing the

Apocalypse build as well with fire sunders. My merc is using Insight, so I don't have to worry about my mana.
I know it's weaker without Infinity against fire immunity, which is why I put 20 hard points in

Bind Demon. At level 38

Bind Demon, the flat damage is around +2400, plus +500% damage. That is like 6 Grief total in damage and maybe more. I bound a cursed, stone skin and holy freez -

Hephasto the Armorer; he hits like a truck.
I thought about putting more hard points in

Summon Defiler. But I noticed that the

Apocalypse covered quite a big area that contained the defiler's targets for most of the time. I feel it's kind of a waste, which is another reason I chose

Bind Demon.

ya, im using the Insight too, i cant stand that i need to keep on drinking potion for my mana, even i use the

Hex Siphon.

then i might have to sacrify my defiler hard point to the

Bind Demon, i think it is a good idea, i just follow maxroll guide, but i quite like your idea, i like the idea to have a strong demon to tank boss or uber

for the demon, you prefer

Holy Freeze aura or fanatism aura?

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 18 hours ago

Flyhorse wrote: 18 hours ago

I just remembered that the Flickering Flame and

Magefist also add skill level to

Blood Boil and

Summon Tainted because they are partial fire skills.
I am playing the

Apocalypse build as well with fire sunders. My merc is using Insight, so I don't have to worry about my mana.
I know it's weaker without Infinity against fire immunity, which is why I put 20 hard points in

Bind Demon. At level 38

Bind Demon, the flat damage is around +2400, plus +500% damage. That is like 6 Grief total in damage and maybe more. I bound a cursed, stone skin and holy freez -

Hephasto the Armorer; he hits like a truck.
I thought about putting more hard points in

Summon Defiler. But I noticed that the

Apocalypse covered quite a big area that contained the defiler's targets for most of the time. I feel it's kind of a waste, which is another reason I chose

Bind Demon.

ya, im using the Insight too, i cant stand that i need to keep on drinking potion for my mana, even i use the

Hex Siphon.

then i might have to sacrify my defiler hard point to the

Bind Demon, i think it is a good idea, i just follow maxroll guide, but i quite like your idea, i like the idea to have a strong demon to tank boss or uber

for the demon, you prefer

Holy Freeze aura or fanatism aura?

I didn't take much time to bind Hephasto in the right type. Since cursed is a must and with a 5% proc rate, Lightening enchanted is the best to proc AMP faster;

Holy Freeze is a little bit slower to proc amp, but still fast. If you can find a demon having cursed, lightning enchanted, and

Holy Freeze, it's probably the best you can get. Others like stone skin, fire immune are just bonus to have.

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 19 hours ago

vued wrote: 19 hours ago

vs. Sundered enemies the difference is
- for first charm: 51.8% damage efficiency
- for second charm: 54.1% damage efficiency

That's a relative damage increase by 4.4%

Since sundered enemies are usually the ones that slow you down and everything else dies in one or two shots anyways, I'd also go with -6 enemy res one.

51.8% or 54.1% is for the - res charm?

54.1% for the -6 enemy res

I think it depends on:
a) Your total current negative fire res and +fire skill damage. You told us your gear, but a lot of it is variable negative res and variable fire skill damage.

b) Whether you primarily do

Apocalypse (which adds -40 neg res) or RoF/FW

c) Preference

With a) and b), one can do the math vs. sundered and non-sundered enemies.

I suspect it's close to a toss-up for you.

I generally prefer negative res because sundered enemies annoy me the most, but as an example, if you already have -50 fire res vs. immunes and +30% fire skill damage, then vs. sundered enemies, with

-6 res: (100-95+50+6)/(100-95+50) = 1.109x damage multiplier

+14 skill: (100+30+14)/(100+30) = 1.108x damage multiplier

Basically the same, and then vs. non sundered the 14% will be a little bit better. If your primary attack is

Apocalypse then the +14% is the way to go.

But it's close and comes down to preference.

I run a fire warlock and my primary attack is

Ring of Fire. For heralds and bosses I use

Flame Wave and

Apocalypse with RoF in between. I also run Insight instead of Infinity because I find Infinity doesn't make a huge difference in kill speed and I hate chugging potions.

Only place Infinity impacts kill speed a bit is bosses & heralds.

varangium wrote: 3 hours ago

I think it depends on:
a) Your total current negative fire res and +fire skill damage. You told us your gear, but a lot of it is variable negative res and variable fire skill damage.

b) Whether you primarily do

Apocalypse (which adds -40 neg res) or RoF/FW

c) Preference

With a) and b), one can do the math vs. sundered and non-sundered enemies.

I suspect it's close to a toss-up for you.

I generally prefer negative res because sundered enemies annoy me the most, but as an example, if you already have -50 fire res vs. immunes and +30% fire skill damage, then vs. sundered enemies, with

-6 res: (100-95+50+6)/(100-95+50) = 1.109x damage multiplier

+14 skill: (100+30+14)/(100+30) = 1.108x damage multiplier

Basically the same, and then vs. non sundered the 14% will be a little bit better. If your primary attack is

Apocalypse then the +14% is the way to go.

But it's close and comes down to preference.

I run a fire warlock and my primary attack is

Ring of Fire. For heralds and bosses I use

Flame Wave and

Apocalypse with RoF in between. I also run Insight instead of Infinity because I find Infinity doesn't make a huge difference in kill speed and I hate chugging potions.

Only place Infinity impacts kill speed a bit is bosses & heralds.

interesting... now i have the dilemma again, haha.. but most of the time im using

Ring of Fire too for minion,

Apocalypse is abit slow in animation time, for boss then i throw everything to him, with my tanky demon taking the hit.

Do you put 1 point wonder in

Bind Demon or 15/20 hard point to get unique demon?

PinacaTheGreat wrote: 1 hour ago

varangium wrote: 3 hours ago

I think it depends on:
a) Your total current negative fire res and +fire skill damage. You told us your gear, but a lot of it is variable negative res and variable fire skill damage.

b) Whether you primarily do

Apocalypse (which adds -40 neg res) or RoF/FW

c) Preference

With a) and b), one can do the math vs. sundered and non-sundered enemies.

I suspect it's close to a toss-up for you.

I generally prefer negative res because sundered enemies annoy me the most, but as an example, if you already have -50 fire res vs. immunes and +30% fire skill damage, then vs. sundered enemies, with

-6 res: (100-95+50+6)/(100-95+50) = 1.109x damage multiplier

+14 skill: (100+30+14)/(100+30) = 1.108x damage multiplier

Basically the same, and then vs. non sundered the 14% will be a little bit better. If your primary attack is

Apocalypse then the +14% is the way to go.

But it's close and comes down to preference.

I run a fire warlock and my primary attack is

Ring of Fire. For heralds and bosses I use

Flame Wave and

Apocalypse with RoF in between. I also run Insight instead of Infinity because I find Infinity doesn't make a huge difference in kill speed and I hate chugging potions.

Only place Infinity impacts kill speed a bit is bosses & heralds.

interesting... now i have the dilemma again, haha.. but most of the time im using

Ring of Fire too for minion,

Apocalypse is abit slow in animation time, for boss then i throw everything to him, with my tanky demon taking the hit.

Do you put 1 point wonder in

Bind Demon or 15/20 hard point to get unique demon?

1 point wonder

Bind Demon and load up on demons skillers when binding to hit level 20 and get aura. I have a Stone skin vile lancer and she does great.

However, I mainly do this because I haven’t done a respec since the patch and I had maxed

Blood Oath before. But

Blood Oath is super diminishing returns now, especially with the demon health

Cap. If I did a respec I might try going the other way and maxing

Bind Demon with 1 point

Blood Oath, but I think both approaches are similar. I accidentally consumed my pre patch heph, but I’m very happy with my Stone skin vile lancer, I don’t notice a difference.