Unid Torch question

What's the likelihood these are scams nowadays? I remember back in the day people talked about exploits where sellers knew what torches stats were despite being unidentified and only sold mediocre to trash torches. Makes me uneasy about purchasing one.

Highly doubt that is the case anymore now that item generation is server-side.. But I could always be wrong!

Here's the only reference I could find, where people were abusing frequent server rollbacks last year:

https://forums.d2jsp.org/topic.php?t=87433781&f=148

Thankfully, there haven't been any rollbacks for a while, so I think you're probably safe buying unids now.

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

Highly doubt that is the case anymore now that item generation is server-side.. But I could always be wrong!

When has the items generation been client-side?

@Schnorki I got a notification that you quoted me in this topic, but don't see your reply. Did you delete it?

I did indeed.

Either way:
Trading for UNID should be fairly safe these days.

Items are generated server-side. They always have when online though there are/were ways to stack the deck in your favor in some regards (forcing SoJs for example).

Back in the olden days, there was a multitude of ways to figure out what an item is while keeping it UNID or getting it back to UNID after IDing. That allowed folks to sell trash as UNID and the good ones ID'd for maximized profits.

Today however, with D2:R, those methods either do not exist anymore, are unknown to the general public and/or in the case of rollbacks have become rare and unpredictable enough to not really be useful for that purpose anymore. As a result, the odds of someone knowingly selling you an UNID piece of crap torch are fairly low.

That obviously does not go for all items as for some of them, you know it won't be any good simply based on where it dropped. UNID unique rings and sacred armors for example.

How did forcing Sojs work? I was pretty aware of all exploits at that time (cheers to mIRC and Blizzhacers), but don't think I remember this one in particular?

ALLEyezOnMe wrote: 2 years ago

How did forcing Sojs work? I was pretty aware of all exploits at that time (cheers to mIRC and Blizzhacers), but don't think I remember this one in particular?

Uniques used to be by presence and drop in order. So nagel -> manald -> SoJ for rings (if you found 3 in the same game).
If a unique existed in a game, either because it dropped or because you had it on your char, it couldn't drop anymore.

As a result, if you did your farming on a char that had a nagel and a manald with it, those two could no longer drop and the next unique ring you get had to be an SoJ. So farm until you find a unique ring (guaranteed SoJ), mule that SoJ off your farming char to enable SoJ drops again, rinse and repeat.

The downside was that your farming char basically had to be an undergeared PoS because if you had any good uniques on it, those same uniques couldn't drop anymore.

ALLEyezOnMe wrote: 2 years ago

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

Highly doubt that is the case anymore now that item generation is server-side.. But I could always be wrong!

When has the items generation been client-side?

I imagine back before D2R. Wasn't it all client-side? I mean, you could just hero edit items, so there really wasn't any restriction to what you could do. And I believe there used to be programs that could scan Memory and see unid properties. Found a couple references to it from early 2000's. For example:

Nov 26, 2007
#10
"There is a program that will tell the properties of an unidentified torch 'that drops'. A message will appear similar to text chat that says 'An Amazon torch has dropped that has the stats x/x'.
I would never buy an unid torch, especially after learning of this program."

https://www.diabloii.net/forums/threads ... ms.612884/

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

ALLEyezOnMe wrote: 2 years ago

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

Highly doubt that is the case anymore now that item generation is server-side.. But I could always be wrong!

When has the items generation been client-side?

Back before D2R. There used to be programs that could scan Memory and see unid properties. Found a couple references to it from early 2000's.

Yeah, but the items were still getting generated on the server and not locally. It's just that once you obtained them, their stats were already known (despite the items being unidentified), which enabled the client-side Memory scanning part.
My point is, I don't think that anything changed with the way items are being generated, but rather the code became "more modern" and prevented the exploits of the past (at least as far as the general public is concerned).
Back in the day it was just too easy to manipulate the packets to your benefit, be it buying the same item from a vendor over and over again, without it disappearing from the window or having an image of an item appear in the trade window, instead of the actual item

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

I imagine back before D2R. Wasn't it all client-side? I mean, you could just hero edit items, so there really wasn't any restriction to what you could do.

You can do that now.

That's not a D2 vs. D2:R thing, that's an offline single player vs. b.net thing.

Schnorki wrote: 2 years ago

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

I imagine back before D2R. Wasn't it all client-side? I mean, you could just hero edit items, so there really wasn't any restriction to what you could do.

You can do that now.

That's not a D2 vs. D2:R thing, that's an offline single player vs. b.net thing.

Right, but this guy is specifically talking about trading, which is D2R B.net online. D2R offline mode can obviously still be hacked, hero edited, etc, but not really relevant to this convo IMO, since no trading there. But yes, if you want the explicit, perfectly correct wording, I should have said "I imagine back before D2R B.Net online mode". Apologies if I was unclear.

To answer the OP's question - in my opinion, trading for unidentified items nowadays is pretty safe.

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

Schnorki wrote: 2 years ago

Zero187 wrote: 2 years ago

I imagine back before D2R. Wasn't it all client-side? I mean, you could just hero edit items, so there really wasn't any restriction to what you could do.

You can do that now.

That's not a D2 vs. D2:R thing, that's an offline single player vs. b.net thing.

Right, but this guy is specifically talking about trading, which is D2R B.net online. D2R offline mode can obviously still be hacked, hero edited, etc, but not really relevant to this convo IMO, since no trading there. But yes, if you want the explicit, perfectly correct wording, I should have said "I imagine back before D2R B.Net online mode". Apologies if I was unclear.

Nah, I got what you were saying. I was merely saying that it is only applicable to non-b.net. Even in the original D2, that stuff was handled server-side and you couldn't just edit your b.net chars.

Given, one would be forgiven to believe you could, considering some of the ridiculous and "impossible" items that ended up existing there (occi ring being a perfect example) but those actually got created via bugs in the game itself, not by editing them in.

Schnorki wrote: 2 years ago

Given, one would be forgiven to believe you could, considering some of the ridiculous and "impossible" items that ended up existing there (occi ring being a perfect example) but those actually got created via bugs in the game itself, not by editing them in.

Yes and no

The Oculus Ring is actually a good example of a hero-edited item, which was imported to Closed Battle.net through exploiting game IPs with the use of 3rd party software. In short, people were joining Closed Battle.net games with Open Battle.net characters. The EU version of the ring had the same stats as

The Oculus, whereas the USEast / West ones had FBR, instead of FCR, which is a clear indication that it was custom made. Whites / King's Jewels / Quark items / Constricting Ring / Hexing charms / 6 OS

Windforce / 4 OS

Arkaine's Valor are other good examples.
As for other items like the Buriza Armor /

Steelclash Gloves /

Cliffkiller Amulet, rumour has it that a glitch in

Mephisto's loot table was how they came to be, so I'd consider them server-side-created bugged items.

ALLEyezOnMe wrote: 2 years ago

Schnorki wrote: 2 years ago

Given, one would be forgiven to believe you could, considering some of the ridiculous and "impossible" items that ended up existing there (occi ring being a perfect example) but those actually got created via bugs in the game itself, not by editing them in.

Yes and no

The Oculus Ring is actually a good example of a hero-edited item, which was imported to Closed Battle.net through exploiting game IPs with the use of 3rd party software. In short, people were joining Closed Battle.net games with Open Battle.net characters. The EU version of the ring had the same stats as

The Oculus, whereas the USEast / West ones had FBR, instead of FCR, which is a clear indication that it was custom made. Whites / King's Jewels / Quark items / Constricting Ring / Hexing charms / 6 OS

Windforce / 4 OS

Arkaine's Valor are other good examples.
As for other items like the Buriza Armor /

Steelclash Gloves /

Cliffkiller Amulet, rumour has it that a glitch in

Mephisto's loot table was how they came to be, so I'd consider them server-side-created bugged items.

Admittedly, the IP thing is news to me. That must've happened while I was taking a break from gaming. Guess I don't know everything yet after all.
Occu ring, far as I knew, came from the same meph bug. Then again, I never looked at US servers back then.