A new appreciation for Faith

Those who have been around for a while and read through the occasional Amazon topic here might recall that I tend to be on the "die hard

Windforce side" of things. But I figured let me depart from that for a minute and give some credit where credit is due.

For one,

Protector's Stone has very much shifted the eternal debate between WF and Faith from "matter of taste, they're too close to ever get a clear winner" to what in every new top-end variation I can come up with so far typically results in "Faith now wins by a decent margin in the all-rounder builds, at least/especially when focusing on multi shot" and "WF utterly crushes Faith in full-on dmg, pure dex builds, especially for

Strafe". Which makes sense I guess, seeing how Faith has a far easier time squeezing in a Stone without giving up too many other things but WF benefits far more from it when you do fit it in as it becomes pure weapon dmg (which then gets further amplified by the extra dex-ed in full dex builds).

For another, theorycrafting aside, the chronicle had me make a new Faith anyways so I figured might as well give the reality of it a go and do some proper shard running with it.

To no surprise, much like WF before it, it completely annihilates any TZ96 mobs that dare stand in range. With the only obvious exception being some higher tier heralds though even those largely drop disturbingly fast to a bowzon. And off-screen if you have the room.

What did surprise me though and I guess what I'm making this post to give some credit for is that I noticed something that I never noticed before as pre-

Herald, mobs just fell over dead too fast for it to ever become a factor:
Those undead Bobs Faith summons are actually crazy good tanks. Just multi-shotting down the adds around a

Herald tends to pop up a handful of them and as it turns out, they can actually full on

Swarm and face tank most T5 heralds:
Only came up against 2 heralds that didn't get "Faith swarmed". One because I got unlucky and not a single one got spawned off the adds. And one that actually rolled so much dmg that it did finally manage to chew through them.

But those two aside, can't help but be genuinely surprised by how good they are at keeping heralds busy so you can shred them in Peace.

Given, I'm still trying to figure out a better way to get WF back into all-rounder builds as well and really the only reason WF doesn't crush Faith across the board with a Stone is that A1 mercs utterly fail at staying in fana range if you try to use those on a proper build but hey, that's a separate topic.

as someone currently discerning between

Windforce and Faith , this is quite helpful! but like you i need to make Faith for my chronicle, so ill probably just try both

I've wanted Faith for over 20 years and finally got one a few weeks ago. I knew it would be an upgrade over Buriza, but holy cow did things melt so much faster. After I got over that surprise, I became quite appreciative of the skeletons. They are so good as tanks and happily block missiles all day. I finally found a Necromancer build I actually like. As an added bonus, they also get the TZ bonus. When it is cursed, the entire screen is cursed which is amusing.

I think you have both setups with BIS equipment.
Which one would you personally prefer right now, and why?

Schnorki wrote: 10 hours ago

Those who have been around for a while and read through the occasional Amazon topic here might recall that I tend to be on the "die hard

Windforce side" of things. But I figured let me depart from that for a minute and give some credit where credit is due.

For one,

Protector's Stone has very much shifted the eternal debate between WF and Faith from "matter of taste, they're too close to ever get a clear winner" to what in every new top-end variation I can come up with so far typically results in "Faith now wins by a decent margin in the all-rounder builds, at least/especially when focusing on multi shot" and "WF utterly crushes Faith in full-on dmg, pure dex builds, especially for

Strafe". Which makes sense I guess, seeing how Faith has a far easier time squeezing in a Stone without giving up too many other things but WF benefits far more from it when you do fit it in as it becomes pure weapon dmg (which then gets further amplified by the extra dex-ed in full dex builds).

For another, theorycrafting aside, the chronicle had me make a new Faith anyways so I figured might as well give the reality of it a go and do some proper shard running with it.

To no surprise, much like WF before it, it completely annihilates any TZ96 mobs that dare stand in range. With the only obvious exception being some higher tier heralds though even those largely drop disturbingly fast to a bowzon. And off-screen if you have the room.

What did surprise me though and I guess what I'm making this post to give some credit for is that I noticed something that I never noticed before as pre-

Herald, mobs just fell over dead too fast for it to ever become a factor:
Those undead Bobs Faith summons are actually crazy good tanks. Just multi-shotting down the adds around a

Herald tends to pop up a handful of them and as it turns out, they can actually full on

Swarm and face tank most T5 heralds:

image.png

Only came up against 2 heralds that didn't get "Faith swarmed". One because I got unlucky and not a single one got spawned off the adds. And one that actually rolled so much dmg that it did finally manage to chew through them.

But those two aside, can't help but be genuinely surprised by how good they are at keeping heralds busy so you can shred them in Peace.

Given, I'm still trying to figure out a better way to get WF back into all-rounder builds as well and really the only reason WF doesn't crush Faith across the board with a Stone is that A1 mercs utterly fail at staying in fana range if you try to use those on a proper build but hey, that's a separate topic.

IIFOXII wrote: 1 hour ago

I think you have both setups with bis equipment.
Which one would you personally prefer right now, and why?
[..]

Honestly, I'm not truly happy with either right now.
Mind you, that's whining from a VERY high bar about some serious first world problems as both, Faith and WF are even better now than they were pre-RotW and both just shred everything.

They both work exceptionally well when properly geared, no question. But I remain determined to find a better way to bring WF back into the all-rounder build. Or to solve the downsides I still see with Faith. Much as I've often enjoyed the pure dex approach in the past, for sharding and higher level heralds, it is kind of insane, as you're looking around too many close corners and any stray

Herald projectile or right-behind-the-door hit will take you out if you don't get lucky on the

Evade.

In the context of shards, at least a bit more life and hence an all-rounder build just makes more sense. And right now, even I am actually going with Faith for that. Until I find a better way to incorporate a stoned WF at least. As is though, every time I go "all-rounder WF", I just end up going "man I wish A1 mercs didn't suck and were actually usable for fana..." which is...depressing.
Plus Faith does currently seem to have the multi-shot Edge in those builds which is a clear priority over

Strafe for

Herald packs.

I did spend way too much time optimizing new barb options though, at the cost of more zon theorycrafting and testing. So there are a handful of variations still pending that I just haven't gotten around to checking yet and that might solve my problems. But the barb is done now so..full steam ahead on the zon optimization!

Schnorki wrote: 57 minutes ago

Honestly, I'm not truly happy with either right now.

Precisely, the best

Multiple Shot amazon is my Mist

Colossus Crossbow

Mirrored Blades (blades, yea, right) warlock with 85% crushing blow (fur ubers and summit only) and cursed

Fanaticism hephasto.

Just like the best summon necromancer is my warlock, or the best

Corpse Explosion necromancer my warlock, or the best physical damage dealer being my warlock, or the fastest mosaicsin being my warlock, or the best fire damage sorc/druid being my warlock...